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  • [00:24:04] <dvhart> rcn-ee, which repository would that be/
  • [00:24:06] <dvhart> ?
  • [00:27:21] <rcn-ee> http://git.denx.de/?p=u-boot.git;a=summary
  • [00:27:34] <dvhart> thanks
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  • [00:37:33] <dvhart> rcn-ee, have you used that build on a beagleboard xm?
  • [00:38:05] <dvhart> also, how is the u-boot-omap3 related?
  • [00:38:20] <dvhart> it sounds targetted specifically at boards like the bbxm
  • [00:38:38] <dvhart> but hasn't seen an update since April
  • [00:39:01] <rcn-ee> i've used it on the beagle c4/xm and panda.. the u-boot-omap3 is just old...
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  • [00:42:55] <dvhart> ok, v2010.12 is a tag?
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  • [00:52:43] <rcn-ee> dvhart, yeap, that's the latest release..
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  • [00:53:24] <dvhart> thanks, writing up the recipes now to try it
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  • [01:00:01] <dvhart> rcn-ee, so which "make *_config" do you use for the bbxm ?
  • [01:00:54] <rcn-ee> omap3_beagle_config
  • [01:01:37] <dvhart> ah... I'm looking in the wrong place I see
  • [01:01:45] <dvhart> was looking for the target in the Makefile
  • [01:02:58] <ds2> Hmmmm
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  • [01:04:37] <djlewis> doth sayeth ds2
  • [01:06:00] <ds2> how goes the middle continent?
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  • [01:09:55] <djlewis> it's turning cold and wetter again, towards another ice age
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  • [01:10:28] <ds2> and it the beagle's fault for not running hot enough huh? ;)
  • [01:11:13] <djlewis> yeah, what were those engineers thinking ;)
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  • [01:13:12] <ds2> Panda to the rescue!
  • [01:13:42] <djlewis> hehee
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  • [02:03:38] <prpplague> jkridner|work: ping
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  • [02:08:10] <Sengoku> Hey
  • [02:08:59] <Sengoku> http://groups.google.com/group/beagleboard/tree/browse_frm/month/2009-06/827691ec1896db29?hide_quotes=no
  • [02:09:53] <Sengoku> How long will RMA take?
  • [02:10:18] <mru> your beagle is broken?
  • [02:12:16] <Sengoku> USB drops/disconnects
  • [02:12:21] <Sengoku> It wont work again 'till reboot
  • [02:12:28] <mru> which rev?
  • [02:12:46] <Sengoku> C3
  • [02:12:58] <mru> usb is known to be unreliable on C3
  • [02:13:29] <mru> at least some of them
  • [02:13:36] <mru> C4 should be stable
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  • [02:14:28] <Sengoku> hmm, so there's nothing i can do
  • [02:14:59] <Sengoku> short of buying that capacityor and figuring out where to solder it
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  • [04:37:47] <elexor> can anyone help me with getting my sound working?
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  • [04:40:44] <elexor> alsa-lib: pcm_hw.c:1293:(snd_pcm_hw_open) open '/dev/snd/pcmC0D0p' failed (-16): Device or resource busy
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  • [04:42:12] <NeedPPPtoWork> Has any one got PPP to work on some flavor of Linux for the BeagleBoard? (I am trying to tether it to a cell phone by USB) Anybody?
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  • [04:51:30] <aholler_> that should work like anywhere else
  • [04:53:30] <aholler_> http://lmgtfy.com/?q=pppd+chat+usb+gsm
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  • [05:09:50] <elexor> killed pulseaudio sounds now working
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  • [06:23:34] <ds2> arrrggggg android priting virii is spreading
  • [06:25:08] <_bruce> where do i find the src to the xloader (1st stage) for beagleboard XM? is it the same as bb?
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  • [06:25:58] <_bruce> since the old bb is OMAP3530 and the bbxm is DM3730
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  • [06:26:36] <_bruce> http://gitorious.org/x-load-omap3/mainline/trees/master/board/omap3530beagle is what i found, but not sure if it si different for XM
  • [06:28:44] <_bruce> n/m, google tells me it is the same ;]
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  • [06:49:14] <Russ> priting?
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  • [06:55:36] <ds2> porting
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  • [06:58:54] <_bruce> anyone here has the lauterbach arm-20 to ti-14 adapter? want to knwo how much it costs.. lauterbach forces me to "request quote" from them
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  • [07:03:08] <ds2> if you got a lauterbach....
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  • [07:11:08] <_bruce> heh, i just have a cheap jlink ds2
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  • [07:46:59] * Russ notices the most popular form of downloading pcie specifications seems to be bittorrent...
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  • [08:17:25] <koen> mru: congrats on the new ffmpeg situation
  • [08:18:25] <koen> jannau: you as well of course :)
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  • [08:52:00] <av500> gm
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  • [08:54:27] <koen> hey _av500_
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  • [09:07:50] * florian_kc is now known as florian
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  • [10:24:37] <ksinkar> i am about to install dvsdk, before that am I supposed to install the dsp compiler and c6runapp?
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  • [10:42:38] <danilofpires> does anyone already used BeagleBoard interacting with an external application like motor, or 220V/360V equipment?!
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  • [10:46:05] <av500> be careful
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  • [12:09:38] <_Lucretia_> hi, I'm embarking on an os project and looking for an arm platform, was going use emulation to start with via qemu. How exact is the emulation? I mean, do I need to construct a flash image and boot that or does it just use the -kernel option for booting linux images?
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  • [12:21:34] <rdb> Is it possible to communicate to the beagle board over the USB OTG port instead of using the RS232 connection?
  • [12:21:47] <rdb> maybe I can set console=/dev/ttyACM0 or so?
  • [12:26:29] <_av500_> yes
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  • [12:34:03] <rdb> _av500_, how?
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  • [12:49:36] <_Lucretia_> anyone selling a beagleboard?
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  • [12:53:48] <mru> digikey is
  • [12:56:46] <_Lucretia_> i meant anyone selling 2nd hand
  • [12:56:52] <_Lucretia_> and i'm in uk :D
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  • [13:04:52] <_Lucretia_> alternatively, I'd like to use qemu
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  • [13:07:38] <av500> 2nd hand qemu should be cheap
  • [13:08:48] <mru> _Lucretia_: beagle so cheap there's no reason to look for 2nd hand
  • [13:09:04] <mru> and if you buy new, you'll be sure to get the latest revision
  • [13:09:08] * rcn-ee (~voodoo@thief-pool1-30.mncable.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  • [13:09:12] <_Lucretia_> mru: true enough...
  • [13:09:15] <_Lucretia_> mebbe
  • [13:10:26] <_Lucretia_> gonna be out of a job soon tho, so need to save money really
  • [13:10:45] * mru uses beagles to _make_ money
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  • [13:12:18] * _Lucretia_ only wishes
  • [13:14:29] <_Lucretia_> mru: you use linux with it or write your own sw?
  • [13:14:37] <mru> linux
  • [13:16:05] <koen> mru: so you don't write your own sw
  • [13:16:31] <mru> of course not
  • [13:16:41] <mru> why should I when there's so much already written I can copy?
  • [13:17:28] <koen> :)
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  • [13:29:27] <_Lucretia_> well, I want to write an os, so it's clean slate time for me :D
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  • [13:31:53] <mru> why do you want to write an os?
  • [13:32:14] <mru> I can't imagine there isn't an existing suitable one
  • [13:32:22] <mru> unless it's just for fun of course
  • [13:32:25] <mru> and learning
  • [13:32:29] <_Lucretia_> both
  • [13:32:41] <jannau> too few to choose from as long as hurd isn't finished
  • [13:32:42] <_Lucretia_> and always wanted to
  • [13:32:49] <_Lucretia_> jannau: aye
  • [13:32:54] <_Lucretia_> hurd will never be finished
  • [13:32:59] <_Lucretia_> moving goalposts, etc.
  • [13:33:00] <mru> learning is always a valid reason
  • [13:33:02] <koen> oooooh, swscale cleanups
  • [13:33:15] <av500> koen: proposed
  • [13:33:35] <mru> but unless your needs are very special, you're not likely to outdo existing ones anytime soon
  • [13:34:15] <koen> I guess writing your own OS would be fun
  • [13:39:08] <_Lucretia_> hence the need for qemu to work right, I spose
  • [13:39:22] <mru> do not attempt to write an os on top of qemu
  • [13:39:26] * torez (~torez@linaro/torez) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  • [13:39:27] <mru> it's much too buggy for that
  • [13:39:41] <mru> you need real hardware
  • [13:40:32] <ynezz> and some coffee
  • [13:40:43] <av500> does it have to be a complex beast like omap3 to learn OS writing?
  • [13:41:02] <mru> I'd say a simpler system would be preferable
  • [13:41:08] <mru> maybe an arm9tdmi
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  • [13:41:15] <_Lucretia_> not really, just want to be able to get an os on it
  • [13:41:16] <mru> or a 926
  • [13:41:19] <_Lucretia_> and booting
  • [13:41:23] <mru> but even that's getting quite complex
  • [13:41:38] <_Lucretia_> it's going to be a microkernel
  • [13:41:55] <_Lucretia_> any thoughts on some real hw would be cool
  • [13:41:57] <mru> irrelevant
  • [13:42:07] <mru> any kind of kernel is simpler to write on a simpler system
  • [13:42:09] <_Lucretia_> and the cheaper the better
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  • [13:42:15] <ynezz> msp430 :p
  • [13:42:21] <mru> the omap3 needs tons of boring setup before you can do anything useful
  • [13:42:23] <av500> ynezz: lunchpad
  • [13:42:27] <ynezz> or ohmyduino
  • [13:42:27] <_Lucretia_> mru, aye...tried looking at the beagle docs, fek me, it's complicated
  • [13:42:40] <ynezz> av500: lunchtime?
  • [13:42:41] <mru> lunchpad might be a bit too simple
  • [13:42:47] <av500> true
  • [13:42:56] <mru> something cortex-m3 based perhaps
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  • [13:43:16] <av500> mmu would be nice
  • [13:43:51] <mru> M3 can be fitted with an mmu
  • [13:43:57] <mru> as is done in the omap4
  • [13:44:28] <_Lucretia_> it can be a board or a board that can fit onto a breadboard
  • [13:44:29] * rsalveti (~rsalveti@201.82.72.47) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  • [13:44:43] <_Lucretia_> was looking at mbed but wasn't sure if that could do what I'm after
  • [13:45:09] * mru got is hands on an fgpa based cortex-m dev system
  • [13:45:15] <mru> build your own soc
  • [13:45:41] <av500> mru: pls add 1080p for me
  • [13:45:45] <av500> decode
  • [13:45:48] <av500> VP8
  • [13:45:58] <_Lucretia_> mru: like i said, cheaper the better :D
  • [13:45:58] <av500> and firechrome
  • [13:46:40] <mru> this thing is not cheap
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  • [14:16:11] <jkridner|work> good morning all
  • [14:18:01] <koen> rcranetx: where's the crane uboot located? I have some patches to get expansionboards working
  • [14:18:01] <mru> all hail jkridner|work
  • [14:18:21] <mru> where's my crane located?
  • [14:18:23] <jkridner|work> *grumble*
  • [14:18:36] <jkridner|work> mru: good question. thought it was on the way to Roger.
  • [14:18:42] <mru> probably is
  • [14:19:11] <koen> the crane that was sent the week before arrived today on my doorstep
  • [14:19:37] <koen> jkridner|work: http://www.flickr.com/photos/koenkooi/5370010264/
  • [14:20:42] * lyakh (~lyakh@pD9EB8E3A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Quit: thanks, bye)
  • [14:24:42] <av500> my crane is in memphis
  • [14:25:06] <koen> refreshing keeps it there
  • [14:25:24] <av500> actually its in german memphis aka leipzig
  • [14:25:28] <koen> everytime you hit F5 they have to stop the plan from taking off and see if the parcel is still present
  • [14:25:30] * mru suspects it's in self-refresh
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  • [14:47:36] <epifunny> is anyone familiar with narcissus here; i have tried 3 times but it seems to get stuck on the build screen. Twice i have waited for more than 2 hours.
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  • [14:48:10] <epifunny> is it usually like this, or i am doing something wrong/
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  • [14:54:33] <armin76> koen: ^
  • [14:55:45] <epifunny> i have been able to get past the pre-configuration stage all of the 3 times though.
  • [14:58:43] <koen> have more patience
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  • [15:00:18] <speakman> I'm having a OMAP3 board similar to beagle, and I'd like to find a way to rewrite my root filesystem via a web interface. The web part is already done, but do anyone have any idea how to practically reflash the rootfs (jffs2)?
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  • [15:02:06] <aholler> wither boot from something else or use u-boot
  • [15:02:48] <speakman> wither..?
  • [15:02:55] <aholler> s/wither/either/
  • [15:03:48] <av500> aholler: why?
  • [15:04:19] * killring (~killring@adsl-76-234-142-143.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  • [15:06:15] <speakman> anyone knows how pivot_root works?
  • [15:06:25] <aholler> av500: every tried mkfs.ext4 on your current root?
  • [15:06:42] <speakman> I'm thinking of decoupling the actual jffs2 flash partition while reflashing it
  • [15:07:07] <av500> aholler: I'm a strong proponent on running rootfs from a ramdisk :)
  • [15:08:06] <speakman> I thought of setting up a temporary rootfs in /tmp (tmpfs mounted) and pivot_root to that prior the firmware upgrade
  • [15:08:13] <speakman> what do you think?
  • [15:08:46] <aholler> speakman: you don't need pivot-root, that's possible without. you just have to be sure you are not using your root.
  • [15:09:14] <speakman> aholler: remounting it read-only?
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  • [15:10:34] <speakman> aholler: extract a mini-rootfs onto /tmp/subdir and chroot my upgradescript there?
  • [15:11:00] <aholler> you could have at look a lsof to see what all is used from the partition you want to get destroy.
  • [15:12:03] <av500> speakman: what do you do if something fails?
  • [15:13:16] <speakman> av500: it should be pretty seldom, but if it does, we just flash it through u-boot
  • [15:13:41] <speakman> the web upgrade is just a simple way for customers to upgrade the firmware
  • [15:13:58] <av500> and for uboot they have to send it back?
  • [15:14:05] <speakman> unfortently, yes
  • [15:14:21] <speakman> But I'm pretty sure it won't be too many cases of that
  • [15:14:22] <aholler> ;)
  • [15:14:33] <av500> speakman: you must have few customers :)
  • [15:15:03] <aholler> speakman: don't forget to allow a downgrade
  • [15:15:09] <speakman> av500: no, but the devices is pretty simple and won't touch the rootfs at all
  • [15:15:26] <av500> speakman: then make it read only :)
  • [15:15:30] <av500> always
  • [15:15:33] <speakman> aholler: thanks, I believe reflashing the rootfs mtd partition would open up for downgrades as well
  • [15:15:40] <epifunny> do have a request a feature page for Narcissus? Wanted to request a generation of a come-back-later link
  • [15:15:43] <speakman> av500: it will be read only :)
  • [15:16:05] <speakman> it's just that it first has to be erased before "nandwrite" can take over
  • [15:16:28] <speakman> and after erasing, there will be no /lib and no /bin and so on
  • [15:16:39] <aholler> if you have enough flash, just use two partitions and use fw_setenv to swith between
  • [15:16:52] <speakman> of course, static linking writenand might help
  • [15:17:08] <speakman> aholler: unfortently, I will probably need every single byte available in flash :(
  • [15:17:36] <speakman> aholler: doubling the flash size is a major price factor in our small volume
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  • [15:29:06] <speakman> just did a mount -i remount,ro / && /tmp/flash_eraseall /dev/mtd4 && /tmp/nandwrite -p /dev/mtd4 newrootfs.jffs2
  • [15:29:16] <speakman> and it fell through perfectly :)
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  • [15:30:28] <aholler> maybe you should think about why using nandwrite. have a look at how your pv-linux updates itself.
  • [15:30:37] <aholler> s/pv/pc/
  • [15:34:56] <ynezz> hm, erase && nandwrite, what if that erase will fail somewhere, sometime? :) "oh dear, that update is taking sooo long, I'll try to reset that damn box"
  • [15:35:28] <speakman> ynezz: an guarantee issue ;)
  • [15:35:48] <speakman> why would flash_eraseall fail randomly?
  • [15:36:00] <speakman> If it fails, there is something wrong with the hardware anyway
  • [15:36:18] <speakman> of cours, I could try flash_eraseall a couple of times before giving up
  • [15:36:31] <speakman> I still can't see why it should fail randomly?
  • [15:37:00] <speakman> aholler: are you suggesting using a sort of packaging system (dpkg/ipkg)?
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  • [15:40:10] <aholler> if you need such
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  • [15:41:06] <speakman> I don't consider it an options, since these devices can be placed far away from any network connections. Handing over a pure firmware image for a system administrator is handy.
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  • [15:42:18] <speakman> About having / read-only the whole time; how could one handle permanent changes such as network settings et al?
  • [15:42:23] <aholler> man tar
  • [15:42:36] <speakman> ?
  • [15:43:40] <aholler> as answer do packaging system/network. anyway, it's your product, only you know you will need.
  • [15:43:49] <aholler> s/do/to/
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  • [15:45:00] <Russ> mru, ffmpeg situation?
  • [15:45:19] <mru> Russ: bit of a revolution
  • [15:45:30] <av500> no code has been harmed
  • [15:45:46] <Russ> Tunisian style?
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  • [15:51:15] <ynezz> speakman: unionfs for example
  • [15:52:31] <speakman> ynezz: true. That would make factory reset just flash_eraseall /dev/the_writable_mtd also
  • [15:52:44] <speakman> or at least mkfs.jffs2 .. :)
  • [15:54:06] <ynezz> or rather rm -fr /config/* :p
  • [15:54:30] <speakman> why /config ?
  • [15:54:53] <ynezz> because it's more omap4 friendly
  • [15:55:19] <speakman> hm, not following - how is that?
  • [15:55:20] <ynezz> I don't know, it's first nonsense comming out of my head
  • [15:55:27] <speakman> i see
  • [15:55:28] <speakman> :p
  • [15:55:40] <speakman> but unionfs is a good idea though
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  • [15:57:17] <DaveDavenport> howdy
  • [15:57:35] <DaveDavenport> Does the perf tool (from linux kernel tool/perf/) work on arm?
  • [15:57:44] <DaveDavenport> if so is it packaged in angstrom (cannot find it)
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  • [19:38:28] <koen> mru: quick ffmpeg question: libavcodec/dca.c:1360: error: 'for' loop initial declaration used outside C99 mode
  • [19:38:39] <koen> mru: is that XOPENSOURCE related?
  • [19:39:31] <dvhart> koen, I wouldn't think so
  • [19:40:03] <dvhart> sounds more like a complaint about a "for(int i" vs. a "int i; for(i" without C99 declared
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  • [19:48:44] <koen> I fixed it
  • [19:48:58] <koen> turns out I sed'ed out the check for c99
  • [19:49:56] <mru> koen: ugh, I'll get that fixed
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  • [19:52:25] <koen> mru: I had: 'sed -i -e s:'check_cflags -std=c99'::g ${S}/configure' in my buildscripts for some reason
  • [19:52:32] <koen> removing that made it work
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  • [19:56:54] <mru> yes, but such code shouldn't be there
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  • [20:03:23] <koen> mru: how much "faster" does ffmpeg vp8 decoding get with your branch?
  • [20:03:49] <mru> a lot
  • [20:04:09] <mru> be warned, it's a work in progress
  • [20:04:14] <mru> the branch is subject to rebasing
  • [20:04:50] <koen> I'm about to propose that OE blocks merge commits
  • [20:04:59] <koen> jannau is on to something with that
  • [20:05:42] <dvhart> Jefro1, ping
  • [20:06:03] <dvhart> Jefro1, would you like to be CC'd on the pull request for bbxm support in yocto?
  • [20:06:05] <koen> dvhart: you do know that the angstrom yocto layer has awesome beagle support, right?
  • [20:06:08] <mru> yeah, allowing merge commits from inexperienced devs gets ugly fast
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  • [20:06:39] <dvhart> koen, I did find that it's x-load and u-boot worked out of the box :-)
  • [20:07:23] <k3nt> anyone know what the wait time is on the xm from digikey
  • [20:07:42] <dvhart> k3nt, I got my xM in fairly short order
  • [20:07:52] <dvhart> maybe a week, week and a half
  • [20:08:00] <dvhart> still don't have a pandaboard though ;-)
  • [20:08:11] <k3nt> ok... don't want to fall into a pandaboard situation
  • [20:08:19] <k3nt> hah
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  • [20:08:44] <koen> dvhart: too bad half the hardware doesn't work with standard yocto
  • [20:08:47] <koen> well, more than half
  • [20:09:25] <dvhart> considering the amount of hardware out there....
  • [20:09:38] <koen> that's a poor excuse
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  • [20:09:43] <koen> a really poor one
  • [20:09:59] <koen> since you mention beagle as the arm showcase platform for yocto
  • [20:10:03] <dvhart> it's not meant to be an excuse actually. I'm working on improving the hardware support
  • [20:10:11] <dvhart> I've added at least 3 boards in the last couple months
  • [20:10:49] <dvhart> koen, it worked on beagleboard at launch
  • [20:10:57] <dvhart> the xM through in a wrench with the removal of NAND
  • [20:11:11] <dvhart> then our "upgrade" to gcc 4.5.1 broke the xload and uboot recipes
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  • [20:11:28] <dvhart> and lack of xM support was a glaring problem
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  • [20:11:35] <dvhart> which is why I went after it
  • [20:12:04] <koen> even on regular beagle half of the hw doesn't work
  • [20:12:50] <dvhart> koen, really? I was working on the DLNA demo last week and have serial, usb ethernet and audio out working
  • [20:12:58] <dvhart> what have you noticed is broken?
  • [20:13:03] <Crofton> I'm really hoping yocto/oe can make BSP's much easier to maintain
  • [20:13:05] <dvhart> (I haven't tested grapics myself)
  • [20:13:34] <dvhart> and I've working with ARM since Friday, so I'm sure I'm unaware of some of the issues
  • [20:13:43] <dvhart> pretty new to this space
  • [20:14:05] <dvhart> Crofton, there is definitely some work being done in that area
  • [20:16:17] <koen> dvhart: dsp, sgx, crypto?
  • [20:16:22] <dvhart> noted
  • [20:16:31] <dvhart> you didn't happen to open bugs did you?
  • [20:17:38] <koen> I have my layer
  • [20:17:55] <dvhart> is it something you'd consider contributing upstream?
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  • [20:18:54] <koen> for beagle, I am upstream :)
  • [20:19:00] <Crofton> heh
  • [20:19:06] <Crofton> I almost said the same thing
  • [20:19:20] <koen> below that is OE
  • [20:19:26] <dvhart> poor choice in term perhaps
  • [20:20:08] <dvhart> koen, can you point me to your layer (as I said, I've only been working on ARM/beagle since Friday, so I'm still learning who's who and what's where)
  • [20:20:19] <koen> http://gitorious.org/angstrom/angstrom-layers/commits/master
  • [20:20:26] <dvhart> thanks
  • [20:20:57] <koen> dvhart: btw, cp u-boot.bin MLO isn't what you're supposed to do :)
  • [20:22:01] <dvhart> we're copying x-load.bin.ift to MLO
  • [20:22:24] <dvhart> oh
  • [20:22:27] <koen> http://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/README.hardware?h=dvhart/beagle&id=56005ba0e04fac004784cbf86f5fd2152f90b135#n556
  • [20:22:31] <dvhart> haha, my README.HARDWARE
  • [20:22:35] <dvhart> whoops
  • [20:22:36] <dvhart> thanks!
  • [20:22:49] <dvhart> thanks for catching that
  • [20:23:27] <koen> :)
  • [20:23:51] <koen> speaking of ARM, they promised me gator.ko sources last year
  • [20:24:15] <koen> I guess they don't want DS5 support working out of the box by the looks of it
  • [20:24:19] <dvhart> when you said "half the hardware" you were referring to half the hardware on the bb? if so, I retract my earlier reply
  • [20:24:28] <koen> right
  • [20:24:45] <dvhart> ok, I think we're on the same page now then
  • [20:25:04] <dvhart> gotta run for a bit - I'll have a look at your layer, see what I can pick up
  • [20:27:05] <Dan> hey does anyone know how to use dspbridge to write a simple C program for the DSP?
  • [20:27:30] <koen> try dsplink, that's supported
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  • [20:47:35] <djlewis_> gm
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  • [20:48:39] <djlewis_> koen: i just gotta ask, what's with the wifi addon board?
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  • [20:59:50] * Glenn__ (82e2ad56@gateway/web/freenode/ip.130.226.173.86) has joined #beagle
  • [21:00:02] <Glenn__> test
  • [21:00:16] * fisch_ (~Thomas@ppp-93-104-136-150.dynamic.mnet-online.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  • [21:00:20] <Glenn__> My first irc message...
  • [21:01:08] <Glenn__> Is there anybody which has participated with the beagleboard design?
  • [21:01:33] <funkathustra1> Can you be more specific?
  • [21:01:55] <funkathustra1> There are lots of people in here familiar with the hardware design for the BeagleBoard.
  • [21:02:05] <_av500_> Glenn__: ask, dont ask to ask
  • [21:02:14] <Glenn__> I have some ideas to change the board.
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  • [21:02:53] <funkathustra1> ...ok?
  • [21:03:17] <Ceriand|work> Glenn__: corollary to _av500_'s comment, just say it, don't say you're going to say it
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  • [21:03:55] <funkathustra1> what would you like to see changed, Glenn?
  • [21:04:11] * krtaylor (~krtaylor@72.183.125.181) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
  • [21:04:21] <Glenn__> Insert a PoE ieee 802.3at/af controller: find the link later. Purpose power from switch.
  • [21:04:45] * signal11 (esteban@gnv.quaddro.net) has joined #beagle
  • [21:06:28] <Glenn__> e.g. http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tps23770.html and the right "RJ-45"/8P8C plug that support PoE.
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  • [21:07:09] <phantoxe> hi
  • [21:07:40] <funkathustra1> not a bad idea. the actual hardware is developed by a TI team, I believe.
  • [21:07:59] <funkathustra1> I'm not sure the best way to get in touch with them
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  • [21:08:11] <funkathustra1> i will say, however, BeagleBoard has always been designed to be extremely minimal.
  • [21:08:16] <funkathustra1> to keep the cost low.
  • [21:08:50] <Glenn__> This is not minimal with 4 USB ports ;-)
  • [21:09:03] <funkathustra1> yes, the BeagleBoard-xM is definitely scaled-up
  • [21:09:18] <Glenn__> Another idea...
  • [21:09:25] <ynezz> why not PoW?
  • [21:09:30] <Ceriand|work> only because they needed a USB hub to get around a stupid limitation of the OMAP
  • [21:09:56] * virals (~viral@122.178.219.172) Quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  • [21:10:10] <Glenn__> http://www.watterott.net/projects/webradio-arm - RC5 receiver prepared - and VLSI VS1053 ?
  • [21:10:15] * peabody124 (~peabody12@128.249.96.124) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  • [21:10:31] <funkathustra1> yes, I agree, PoE is a great technology
  • [21:10:38] * peabody124 (~peabody12@128.249.96.21) has joined #beagle
  • [21:10:39] <funkathustra1> I don't think a lot of hobyists have it on their home networks
  • [21:10:41] <funkathustra1> I certainly don't.
  • [21:10:46] <Glenn__> PoW - RFID powered?
  • [21:11:02] <ynezz> power over wifi
  • [21:11:07] <funkathustra1> :-D
  • [21:11:10] <ynezz> no cables
  • [21:11:15] <Glenn__> PoE is actually cheap today.
  • [21:11:16] <Ceriand|work> and if you wanted PoE you can just get a cheap, external power-ethernet splitter
  • [21:11:17] <ynezz> cables are boring
  • [21:11:33] <funkathustra1> Ceriand|work: exactly.
  • [21:11:38] * CMoH-notebook (~cipi@95.76.68.223) has joined #beagle
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  • [21:11:52] <funkathustra1> the beagleboard is sort of designed to be augmented with extra, special-purpose peripherals.
  • [21:12:09] <Glenn__> I have a wireless powered mouse ! That is PoW.
  • [21:12:09] <funkathustra1> it's never been designed as a complete, full-of-features single-board-computer.
  • [21:13:27] <_av500_> Glenn__: feel free to propose on the mailing list
  • [21:13:39] <_av500_> but i think it is against the minimalist approach
  • [21:13:50] <_av500_> why make it more expensive for all
  • [21:14:02] <_av500_> with just a few benefiting from it
  • [21:14:19] <djlewis_> amen
  • [21:17:04] <Glenn__> I think a the power circuit on the board could benefit of a redesign. E.g. a birectional SMPS konverter between a rechargeable battery and PoE and USB power.
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  • [21:19:27] <Ceriand|work> Glenn__: you're more than welcome to roll your own, the designs are free to use
  • [21:19:46] <djlewis_> Glenn__: great ideas but aren't you designing a production ready device rather than an expermenters board?
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  • [21:20:16] <Glenn__> Not the intension
  • [21:20:16] <djlewis_> production ready might not describe my intent :(
  • [21:21:59] <Glenn__> But the current is a winner DVI-D, 1GHz and 0,5Gbyte...
  • [21:22:50] <Glenn__> Is there any games for it?
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  • [21:26:01] <Glenn__> I will see if can find that mailing list.
  • [21:27:02] <koen> djlewis_: beagleboardtoys.com is going to sell that soon
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  • [21:27:18] <_av500_> koen: with aes fixed?
  • [21:27:19] <koen> djlewis_: 802.11 abg capable, bluetooth as well
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  • [21:27:34] <koen> _av500_: I've been assured I'll get a firmware with aes fixed :)
  • [21:28:18] <djlewis_> ok, the bluetooth combo makes some sense for the device
  • [21:28:22] <djlewis_> cool
  • [21:28:36] <_av500_> djlewis_: bt is inside the 1271 anyway
  • [21:28:50] * Glenn__ (82e2ad56@gateway/web/freenode/ip.130.226.173.86) Quit (Quit: Page closed)
  • [21:28:50] <koen> FM as well, but there is some confusion about that
  • [21:28:56] <koen> 1281 has gps as well
  • [21:29:38] <_av500_> why do ppl obsess over fm
  • [21:29:49] <djlewis_> like broadcast fm radio?
  • [21:30:03] <_av500_> tx and rx
  • [21:30:06] <_av500_> yawn
  • [21:30:10] <koen> _av500_: I obses over it because people at TI get very quiet when I ask about it :0
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  • [21:30:37] <_av500_> but why do you even ask?
  • [21:31:01] <_av500_> you dont ask for phono in, do you?
  • [21:31:07] <koen> I always ask when propaganda doesn't match the drivers :)
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  • [21:32:24] <mru> you must do a lot of asking
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  • [21:34:25] <djlewis_> lol
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  • [21:46:16] <Kamondelious> is something wrong with narcissus or is it just being really slow?
  • [21:46:46] <sakoman__> koen: please ask about mmc issues on a regular basis
  • [21:47:21] * sakoman__ is concerned that brand new sandisk devices aren't working on his overo and beagle
  • [21:53:34] <djlewis_> might be that bit banged sd
  • [21:54:27] <djlewis_> Kamondelious: soemtimes it runs slowly. let it background task :)
  • [21:55:48] <Kamondelious> djlewis_, yeah no biggie, it's just been around 30 minutes, so I figured I'd ask
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  • [22:07:10] <djlewis_> i suppose a ribbon cable could be put on it and the addon folded out of the way
  • [22:08:13] * djlewis_ would rather see stackable addon cards that cooperate with the mainboard and each other.
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  • [22:14:23] <b7500af1> I'm using CMEM, and allocating non-cached memory pools, but it only works if I writeback and invalidate the buffers on the DSP side. Sounds like I'm doing something wrong, anyone know what?
  • [22:15:12] <jannau> koen: I'm still not entirely convinced that disallowing merge commits is a good idea. merges can be useful. otoh one merge commits for three normal commits is ugly
  • [22:15:23] <b7500af1> *it = writing data back and forth between DSP/ARM
  • [22:16:09] <_av500_> b7500af1: no
  • [22:16:18] <_av500_> non cached refers to the arm side
  • [22:16:20] <_av500_> not the dsp
  • [22:16:26] <_av500_> dsp has own cache
  • [22:16:35] <jannau> not speaking of multiple merges which will duplicate commits since they exist in the non-master branch with a different history
  • [22:17:37] <jannau> koen: I'm checking currently if 'git rev-list --merges FROM..TO' is empty
  • [22:18:03] <b7500af1> _av500_, thanks.. second question non-cached is about 30% slower than cached for a pretty simple memory copy, that sound right?
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  • [22:19:05] <_av500_> what kind of copy?
  • [22:19:29] <_av500_> arm malloc to cmem?
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  • [22:22:11] <dvhart> _av500_, I think I talked to you yesterday about u-boot images failing with garbage to the console. Resolved it by removing -Os from the build as it seems to be a problem with gcc 4.5.1
  • [22:22:21] <b7500af1> _av500_, I allocate 1MB of cmem pool then the arm and dsp alternate incrementing the value in the pool
  • [22:24:22] <_av500_> b7500af1: where is the memcpy?
  • [22:24:28] <_av500_> dvhart: ic
  • [22:25:01] * _av500_ still wonders what the obsession with gcc 4.5.1 is....
  • [22:25:32] <dvhart> in my case it's because that's what the environment I use is using, not any particular opinion on my part
  • [22:25:45] <_av500_> dvhart: yes, i understand
  • [22:26:55] <_av500_> b7500af1: dont fret to much about memcpy, in the end its the speed of your dsp algo that will count
  • [22:27:21] <b7500af1> _av500_, well there isn't really a memcpy.. i guess i just meant that the data is 'copied' (really a trivial (though non-pipelined) addition) from one buffer to the other.
  • [22:27:39] <_av500_> on the dsp side?
  • [22:27:46] <b7500af1> correct
  • [22:27:51] <b7500af1> on both sides.
  • [22:27:55] <_av500_> ah
  • [22:28:31] <b7500af1> i know it's next to worthless for any profiling.. but it's the first thing I got working.. so I was just messing around to see how things were going.
  • [22:28:37] <_av500_> good
  • [22:28:42] <_av500_> now do more useful things
  • [22:28:48] <djlewis_> hehee
  • [22:28:59] <b7500af1> 'go and sin no more'
  • [22:29:23] * _av500_ warns everybody about the lenovo Y510 notebook
  • [22:29:45] <djlewis_> _av500_: ok, spill it
  • [22:29:46] <mru> does it turn you into a troll?
  • [22:30:02] <_av500_> djlewis_: somebody forgot it at our office 2ys ago
  • [22:30:11] <_av500_> i set it up now
  • [22:30:13] <_av500_> kbd scks
  • [22:30:16] <_av500_> lcd sucks
  • [22:30:19] <_av500_> battery sucks
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  • [22:30:30] <djlewis_> _av500_: well that just sucks
  • [22:30:51] <mru> send the contents to wikileaks
  • [22:30:58] <djlewis_> ooh
  • [22:30:59] <_av500_> leds gallory
  • [22:30:59] <_av500_> gallore
  • [22:30:59] <_av500_> gloss screen
  • [22:30:59] <_av500_> total fail
  • [22:31:05] <_av500_> its not even good for irc
  • [22:31:11] <_av500_> mru: i wish there was anything leakable
  • [22:31:17] * djlewis_ hates bright blue leds
  • [22:31:21] <mru> you said the battery leaks
  • [22:31:28] <_av500_> mru: somebody brought 2 laptops for a sw demo
  • [22:31:31] <djlewis_> no, it sucks
  • [22:31:38] <_av500_> and just left them
  • [22:31:42] <_av500_> and never asked for them
  • [22:31:49] <mru> djlewis_: leaking is one way for a battery to suck
  • [22:31:53] * virals (~viral@122.178.217.54) Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
  • [22:32:00] <_av500_> it sucks up what it leaks
  • [22:32:01] <djlewis_> it sucks up its own leaks
  • [22:32:06] <_av500_> perpetusuck
  • [22:32:18] <mru> a perpetual suction machine?
  • [22:32:29] <djlewis_> what leaks
  • [22:32:34] <_av500_> perpeptual leakosuction
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  • [22:33:26] <djlewis_> easy to replacebatteries in many brands packs.
  • [22:33:29] <djlewis_> NOT sony
  • [22:33:40] <mru> is that a lipo battery?
  • [22:33:40] <mru> 'cause then you have liposuction
  • [22:33:44] <_av500_> chase: need a nice shooting target?
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  • [22:33:56] <_av500_> its a leako
  • [22:34:15] <djlewis_> let go my lipo, set it free.. da da da da
  • [22:34:32] <_av500_> djlewis_: iknow, i dont think the batt is bad per se, its just too small and the thing drains to much
  • [22:34:49] <djlewis_> cpu section
  • [22:34:53] <djlewis_> suction
  • [22:35:25] <_av500_> c2d 2ghz
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  • [22:35:51] <djlewis_> maybe there was a good reason for them to be left behind?
  • [22:36:06] <djlewis_> management probably got them newer better ones :)
  • [22:36:16] <_av500_> djlewis_: the other one is one of these huge things
  • [22:36:27] <_av500_> some hp that looks like a small drive in cinema
  • [22:36:33] <_av500_> i could not lift it
  • [22:36:50] <aholler> dvhart: there exists a patch for gcc 4.5.1 because 4.5.1 ignores volatile
  • [22:36:59] <_av500_> and the lady was petite, i get your point why she left them :)
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  • [22:37:16] <dvhart> aholler, oooh
  • [22:38:18] <djlewis_> _av500_: she was probably praying your people would not track her down
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  • [22:39:30] <aholler> dvhart: check the current head, it got applied the last days
  • [22:39:54] <dvhart> will do
  • [22:39:57] <dvhart> thanks
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  • [22:44:17] <aholler> dvhart: hmm, doesn't seem so, but here it is: http://lists.denx.de/pipermail/u-boot/2011-January/084885.html
  • [22:44:27] <dvhart> thanks, I wasn't finding it
  • [22:45:06] <dvhart> oh, hah, I thought you meant a patch to gcc
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  • [22:45:11] <dvhart> never would have found it
  • [22:45:18] <aholler> just use 4.5.2
  • [22:45:32] <mru> also buggy
  • [22:45:35] <mru> use linaro gcc
  • [22:45:40] <mru> or OE
  • [22:45:47] <aholler> yes, but better than 4.5.1
  • [22:45:51] <dvhart> I don't have that option right now - although there is some work to integrate the linaro fixes
  • [22:46:00] <mru> 4.5.2 has a bug that turns stores into loads in certain situations
  • [22:46:02] <mru> very bad
  • [22:46:16] <mru> causes this: http://fate.ffmpeg.org/arm-linux-gcc-4.5/20110119173338
  • [22:47:26] <aholler> I assume you mean PR45094
  • [22:48:25] <mru> yeah
  • [22:48:35] <aholler> sometimes it seems they just forget to apply some fixes.
  • [22:48:56] <mru> gcc development is rather chaotic
  • [22:48:59] <ds2> now if that happened to bank accounts... buggy atms that turn withdrawls to deposits ;)
  • [22:49:24] <mru> the bank would sue you for fraud
  • [22:50:11] <ds2> only if I manufactured the ATM ;)
  • [22:50:42] <mru> that's what you'd like to think
  • [22:50:51] <mru> but you're talking about banks here
  • [22:50:52] * tolot (~tolot@f050094131.adsl.alicedsl.de) Quit (Quit: Verlassend)
  • [22:50:53] <aholler> banks only fix things wich are cheaper than the assurance against
  • [22:51:08] <ds2> let's put it to the test ;)
  • [22:51:08] <Ceriand|work> binutils still uses CVS, AFAIK
  • [22:51:24] <mru> ds2: sure, you build the atm and I'll do the "withdrawal"
  • [22:52:34] <ds2> so we agree GCC should be run by a bank? ;)
  • [22:53:01] <_av500_> libc already is
  • [22:53:11] <mru> dammit _av500_, you're too quick again
  • [22:53:13] <Ceriand|work> there was a bug in binutils-2.20 that caused my C++ app to take about 10 minutes to link
  • [22:53:23] <_av500_> mru: :)
  • [22:53:26] <mru> Ceriand|work: no, that bug is called c++
  • [22:53:42] <Ceriand|work> yea probably, not my choice though
  • [22:54:05] <aholler> Ceriand|work: you never tried to link webkit with 2.20, do you?
  • [22:54:13] <aholler> ;)
  • [22:54:26] <ssvb> does linaro gcc have many bugs backported from gcc trunk?
  • [22:54:36] <ds2> isn't webkit a even bigger bug then C++?
  • [22:54:45] <_av500_> they backport bugs at linaro?
  • [22:54:55] <_av500_> i wonder if they hire
  • [22:54:59] <aholler> bugs are needed
  • [22:55:36] <ds2> didn't you see the feature "#pragma bug(n)"?
  • [22:55:39] * pcacjr (~pcacjr@unaffiliated/pcacjr) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  • [22:55:58] <aholler> no, I use c++ ;)
  • [22:56:48] <ssvb> _av500_: for example codesourcery has backported at least a few bugs from gcc 4.5 to their "4.4" releases :)
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  • [23:02:07] <ssvb> that's the price for being "bleeding edge"
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  • [23:04:19] <aholler> you mean we should stop using arm-devices? ;)
  • [23:04:21] <ssvb> Ceriand|work: yes, this fun thing - http://sourceware.org/ml/binutils/2010-03/msg00270.html
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  • [23:05:43] <ssvb> aholler: I mean I'm going to stay with gcc 4.5 for a while and let the others hit new bugs in linaro, codesourcery, upcoming gcc 4.6 or anything else :)
  • [23:06:42] <aholler> I've seen a lot gcc-patches which where applied to 4.6. but not to 4.5
  • [23:06:46] <aholler> wondered why
  • [23:07:08] <ssvb> bugfixes or new optimizations?
  • [23:07:41] <aholler> don't know, haven't examined it further, just seen 4.5 is affected but 4.6 not.
  • [23:08:38] <mru> aholler: gcc devs generally apply fixes to release branches only after much bitching and 9 months late
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  • [23:12:08] <aholler> anyway, it's better we can blame the toolchain, than getting blamed for our own bugs ;)
  • [23:12:52] <_av500_> aholler: for that reason we run an old toolchain, no dev can make that excuse :)
  • [23:14:06] * b7500af1 (~vt@2001:468:c80:4240:21c:bfff:fe8b:9c32) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
  • [23:14:15] <mru> you're lucky if you can get away with supporting _one_ toolchain
  • [23:14:37] <_av500_> one is enough, we share it :)
  • [23:14:52] <aholler> _av500_: but they still can blame the hw ;)
  • [23:15:22] <_av500_> aholler: course, its TI :)
  • [23:15:44] <mru> at my old job I had to support gcc 2.96 (ugh), 3.4, 4.2, ARM ADS 1.2, 2.0, green hills unknown version, a few ST compilers, and whatever I can't remember
  • [23:16:09] <mru> working around the bugs in all those at once wasn't always easy
  • [23:16:30] <aholler> 2.96? hmm, was that thing which supported c++ through a precompiler? ;)
  • [23:16:39] <_av500_> mru: yes, but you grew superpowers doing that...
  • [23:17:47] <aholler> I remember the switch from gcc 2.x to 3.x because of the abi-changes. that was a real pain
  • [23:18:18] <mru> this was all pure C code thankfully
  • [23:18:43] <mru> _av500_: if you call making sense of core dumps w/o symbols a superpower...
  • [23:19:50] <mru> or finding an obscure bug in a bizarre JNI layer by looking at a screenshot shoing registers and some stack
  • [23:19:59] <mru> +w
  • [23:20:22] <mru> I think those feats were the ones that most impressed my workmates
  • [23:20:39] <_av500_> so dont complain
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  • [23:23:59] <koen> aholler: gcc 2.96 technically doesn't exist
  • [23:24:30] <koen> aholler: redhat put it out, but gnu never released it
  • [23:24:42] <koen> have a look at http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-2.96.html for some passive agressiveness :)
  • [23:24:44] <aholler> ah, that thing was interesting too ;)
  • [23:24:54] <aholler> I remember ;)
  • [23:25:03] <koen> 2.95.x was kinda nice, since egcs got merged back
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  • [23:26:55] * koen searches for his turbo c++ floppy disks
  • [23:27:11] <koen> that is actually a funny story
  • [23:27:17] <koen> I grew up with those floppies
  • [23:27:38] <koen> and the 2nd year in uni, our c++ course lands us in a lab with dos machines
  • [23:27:48] <koen> where we are supposed to use turbo c++
  • [23:27:58] * thaytan (~jan@ppp121-44-106-236.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
  • [23:28:10] <koen> the teachers were alarmed when I walked in with the stack of books that came with it :)
  • [23:28:27] <koen> second part of the c++ course was linux kernel related
  • [23:28:33] <_av500_> er
  • [23:28:46] <_av500_> you did a c++ port?
  • [23:28:53] <koen> did I mention it was c++ for EE's and chem students
  • [23:29:09] <koen> _av500_: no, writeb() to blink leds on the parallel port
  • [23:29:12] <_av500_> ah, more C+O+H?
  • [23:29:15] <aholler> hmm, I had to deal with modula and ever dying macs at the uni.
  • [23:29:36] <koen> aholler: the teaching assistents kept saying "at least it's not modula"
  • [23:29:47] <_av500_> koen: ask jkridner about blinkin leds
  • [23:29:49] <koen> anyhow, zzzz time
  • [23:30:16] <aholler> At that time I wondered how someone could use a mac to do real work. ;)
  • [23:32:24] <aholler> i think they sold them only because of the (at that time) great greylevel monitor
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  • [23:41:25] <Crofton> gn
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  • [23:46:19] * mru and a fellow EE student quite scared some CS teacher's assistants
  • [23:46:29] <mru> they weren't used to seeing efficient code
  • [23:46:41] * peabody124 (~peabody12@128.249.96.21) has joined #beagle
  • [23:46:47] <mru> like multiple data structures overlayed on the same objects
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  • [23:51:08] <ssvb> mru: did they try to disqualify this code as 'wrong'?
  • [23:51:14] <mru> no
  • [23:51:25] <ssvb> you were lucky then
  • [23:51:26] <mru> just mumbled something about "perverse optimisation"
  • [23:52:00] <mru> both of us were working as TAs on some other CS courses
  • [23:52:09] <mru> so we were relatively well-known and respected
  • [23:53:03] <Crofton> is there a list of sane dvimodes?
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