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  • [00:20:37] <djlewis> and I thought I was going to get something productive done today... Har! HAr! ha haaa...
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  • [00:31:52] <Grackle> Where can I report an error in the system reference manual?
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  • [00:33:38] <djlewis> the google BB list
  • [00:38:05] <Grackle> Sounds reasonable. Posted.
  • [00:38:22] <djlewis> Grackle: many errors are known, which one?
  • [00:40:10] <Grackle> djlewis, oh, I didn't see an errata list anywhere so I figured it had only been updated between revisions.. DVI_DATA31 was the error I found.
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  • [00:41:19] <djlewis> thanks for posting it..
  • [00:41:53] <Grackle> np
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  • [01:22:59] <djlewis> going down for a reboot...
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  • [01:23:16] <Animule> http://aztec06.smugmug.com/photos/600893830_Rn2gj-M.jpg
  • [01:23:17] <Animule> LOL
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  • [01:46:52] <daralco> q: why does USR1 flash after booting kernel?
  • [01:47:40] <daralco> ubuntu jaunty running fine, just curious... didn't find answer in the FAQ,
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  • [04:39:56] <_av500_> gm
  • [04:43:27] <sakoman> gm _av500_
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  • [05:22:44] <_av500_> done with my KDE port :)
  • [05:22:50] <_av500_> ?
  • [05:31:28] * yogi (n=florin@iucha.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  • [05:34:05] <sakoman> _av500_: umm . . .
  • [05:34:08] <sakoman> not yet :-)
  • [05:38:25] <sakoman> _av500_: you just gonna have to be happy with gnome for a while!
  • [05:39:28] * raster slinks back to his world of e
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  • [05:48:48] <_av500_> ho raster
  • [05:49:30] <_av500_> sakoman: no need it have that mtn view UI :)
  • [05:50:09] <sakoman> raster: we love e! no slinking required :-)
  • [05:51:14] <raster> _av500_: bing!
  • [05:51:47] <raster> sakoman: it needs much love for embedded
  • [05:51:53] <raster> illume was a nasty first hack
  • [05:52:48] <raster> nb - most of u guys are using (if you have a screen) a "small touchscreen" - not netbooks etc.
  • [05:52:59] <raster> (i mean when doing embedded producty stuff)?
  • [05:53:41] <raster> (just wonderign with all the rage of android + netbook is thats now become a mainline dev target, or its still more of an experiment)
  • [05:53:45] <sakoman> right - we need a really sweet version of e for palo43 type screens
  • [05:54:00] <raster> palo43?
  • [05:54:24] * sakoman still hasn't even played with android
  • [05:54:27] <raster> aaah new gumstigs
  • [05:54:38] <sakoman> raster: the gumstix 4.3" LCD/TS
  • [05:55:09] <raster> aaah that be its name!
  • [05:55:14] <raster> have u fixed the ts problems?
  • [05:55:16] <sakoman> I do a gpe image for it, but that feels so dated
  • [05:55:23] <raster> i saw it working.
  • [05:55:35] <sakoman> and the current e image doesn't feel too good
  • [05:55:37] <raster> but ts/tslib is reporting continual presses
  • [05:55:45] <sakoman> ??
  • [05:55:59] <raster> ie press, move, press, move, press, move, press, move, release
  • [05:56:01] <raster> as opposed to
  • [05:56:09] <_av500_> raster: i dont think android is the right thing for a netbook
  • [05:56:09] <raster> press, move, move, move, move, release
  • [05:56:14] <raster> check with xev
  • [05:56:28] <raster> _av500_: neither do i. doesn't stop people fawning all over it and it making the press
  • [05:56:38] <raster> th ui simpyl was designed for tiny touchsreens
  • [05:56:43] <_av500_> yes
  • [05:56:43] <raster> not bigger mouse-driven ones
  • [05:57:00] <_av500_> but also the apps
  • [05:57:06] <raster> and apps will follow that usage pattern - so just sticking them onto a netbook will make them feel odd
  • [05:57:15] <_av500_> yep
  • [05:57:26] <sakoman> raster: is that press/move stuff a driver issue or a ts_lib issue?
  • [05:57:35] <raster> sakoman: i suspect a combo
  • [05:57:36] <_av500_> wont stop the chinese of making em though ;)
  • [05:58:00] <raster> is driver is just exposing raw data - tslib's modules/config is assuming its a different kind of ts that does thisin the driver level
  • [05:58:31] <raster> _av500_: indeed not. and it wont make them listen to reason either :)
  • [05:58:36] <sakoman> raster: both are standard open source -- we'll have to get the upstream folks to change behavior
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  • [05:58:54] <_av500_> raster: so we need to get the UN involved ...
  • [05:59:08] * _av500_ heads out to buy the kids breakfast...
  • [05:59:12] <raster> sakoman: interesting. maybe it's that in hw older style ts's reported data differently
  • [05:59:13] <raster> not sure
  • [05:59:20] <raster> _av500_: hehehehe
  • [05:59:24] <sakoman> me either
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  • [05:59:33] <raster> sakoman: but right now - that is definitely a layer below x
  • [05:59:46] <raster> oe has been giving me grief of late
  • [05:59:50] <sakoman> amazing that a 73 year old has young kids
  • [05:59:57] <sakoman> :-)
  • [05:59:59] <raster> now my palmt650 images aso hang on boot and bring up no usbnet
  • [06:00:07] <raster> (and no serial console to fiddle with)
  • [06:00:22] <sakoman> that sounds painful
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  • [06:00:24] <raster> too much is broken in oe atm :(
  • [06:00:36] <raster> usbnet on overo still doesnt work even tho i explicit,ly set it to otg
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  • [06:01:22] <sakoman> I've had several folks tell me that gadget stuff is working for them
  • [06:01:24] <raster> 4:01PM ~/oe/oe/recipes/linux/linux-omap/overo > pwd
  • [06:01:24] <raster> /home/raster/oe/oe/recipes/linux/linux-omap/overo
  • [06:01:24] <raster> 4:01PM ~/oe/oe/recipes/linux/linux-omap/overo > grep MUSB defconfig
  • [06:01:25] <raster> ...
  • [06:01:34] <raster> CONFIG_USB_MUSB_OTG=y
  • [06:01:42] <raster> hmm
  • [06:01:52] <raster> angstrom here - oe dev
  • [06:01:56] <raster> bugger.
  • [06:01:58] <raster> grrr
  • [06:02:22] <sakoman> they had to rebuild the kernel since default setting for musb is host
  • [06:02:32] <raster> i think i'll just focus on e for a bit and stop chasing this stuff.
  • [06:02:38] <sakoman> but they reported success after that
  • [06:02:42] <raster> yeah - i rebuilt - no go :(
  • [06:02:50] <raster> g_ether just wont load
  • [06:03:13] <raster> i like the overo - i have a workign serial console - always.
  • [06:03:24] <raster> but i want usbnet for ssh/scp etc.
  • [06:03:46] <sakoman> I haven't done a gadget build in a long time -- will have to try sometime this week when I get a few moments
  • [06:04:10] <raster> sure. i''ve been cycling builds for a few platforms over the past week or so
  • [06:04:19] <raster> the least broken is overo :)
  • [06:04:33] <sakoman> I have a tobi, so I'm spoiled with the ethernet port
  • [06:05:03] <raster> (i want to get this other omap3 device going too, but that's going to need me to have a known 100% working overo or beagle build already, which i don't)
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  • [06:05:18] <raster> well i can add a usbethernet onto its host port
  • [06:05:19] <sakoman> testing a version of the palo43 that has ethernet on it this evening
  • [06:05:40] <raster> but to me thats just a "but usb0 SHOULD work! damnit!"
  • [06:05:41] <raster> :)
  • [06:06:01] <raster> either way - e neds love. i'm redoing illume internals
  • [06:06:03] <raster> splitting it up
  • [06:06:14] <raster> illume "2" will just be layout policy handling.
  • [06:06:18] <sakoman> always something to do :-)
  • [06:06:28] <raster> more generic so you can just force layout of windows
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  • [06:06:52] <raster> (eg run a panel app/win for a "top bar", a "home" app for launcher etc.)
  • [06:07:13] <raster> and other e modules will be able to provide such windows too - when i split them out
  • [06:07:39] <raster> but it's more geenric now handling a very wide range of layouts all the way up to the kind u'd want for netbooks or web tablets
  • [06:07:49] <raster> but this time its going to be clean code - no dirty hacks
  • [06:08:31] <sakoman> sounds like good stuff!
  • [06:08:51] <raster> i hope so... :)
  • [06:09:26] <_av500_> raster: make it rotate as well
  • [06:09:36] <raster> either way - this is not dependant on target
  • [06:09:41] <raster> _av500_: it would rotate before
  • [06:09:47] <raster> if u xrandr -o X
  • [06:09:50] <raster> it will handle it
  • [06:10:22] <raster> if u mean e providing a "rotate" button/control etc. - then.. that's the job of a module to be added
  • [06:10:29] <raster> problem is any rotation in x is clunky
  • [06:10:59] <raster> probably i want to visit rotation as part of a compositor
  • [06:11:18] <_av500_> yes
  • [06:12:00] <_av500_> if you have ogl stuff, you rotate already there
  • [06:12:09] <_av500_> android does that
  • [06:12:23] <raster> depends if the compositro uses gl
  • [06:12:27] <raster> right now thats a nasty topic
  • [06:13:00] <sakoman> good night all!
  • [06:13:03] <raster> (you need to make x hook all pixmaps into being textures - good if u can map textures in linear format (not tiled) and avoid any need for a copy
  • [06:13:05] <raster> )
  • [06:13:07] <raster> sakoman: nite!
  • [06:13:08] <raster> :)
  • [06:13:24] <_av500_> nite
  • [06:13:48] <sakoman> zzzz
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  • [06:15:55] <_av500_> raster: well, then dont use x :)
  • [06:16:04] <raster> pffft
  • [06:16:29] <raster> dont use a soc where the 3d unit is kept under lock and key!
  • [06:16:30] <raster> :)
  • [06:21:42] <_av500_> like every soc
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  • [06:24:59] <raster> depends who you are :)
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  • [06:32:51] <_av500_> raster: I have the DDK, so no issue for me, but for the "general pop." issue is the same
  • [06:34:25] <raster> which is really awful
  • [06:34:49] <raster> it means you get sub-par performance by doing jumps through hoops, copies etc.
  • [06:35:02] <raster> or you do it the only 1 supported way
  • [06:35:42] <_av500_> we need hordes of angry devs camping out in front of imgtec :)
  • [06:35:48] <raster> hahahah
  • [06:35:56] <raster> indeed
  • [06:36:05] <_av500_> and aapl and intl
  • [06:36:14] <raster> in fact gl is to the point where you basically are just passign higher level data to the gpu
  • [06:36:17] <raster> it just blasts away
  • [06:36:22] <raster> it may as well be exposed
  • [06:36:33] <raster> intel i think we need not worry about
  • [06:36:42] <raster> they are into open
  • [06:37:04] <raster> tho their gfx offerings to date just dont cut it for embedded
  • [06:39:08] <raster> i'm considering a new take on gles - and that is to see if i can't get paid to simply build a purpose-built optimised gles X11
  • [06:39:18] <raster> and then a gles wrapper on top tof the "host gl"
  • [06:39:25] <raster> emulating it
  • [06:39:40] <raster> pretty much xgl - but without glx
  • [06:40:00] <raster> also no point tyri0ng to accel x's 2d ops - just do them in software on textures
  • [06:40:10] * _av500_ is lost in x g & l
  • [06:40:23] <raster> i can at least get 1 3d unit to play ball
  • [06:42:23] <raster> basically it means u get n0ormal x
  • [06:42:32] <raster> u can use gles in as many windows as u like
  • [06:42:39] <raster> (no limit to contexts - just ram)
  • [06:43:00] <raster> you get a compositor that uses gles very efficiently
  • [06:43:23] <raster> and it should work everywhere where properly baked gles impls exist
  • [06:43:43] <raster> (that support egl on the framebuffer)
  • [06:43:54] * _av500_ donates au$10
  • [06:44:30] <raster> hehehe
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  • [07:05:51] <_av500_> +eski full of vb, now get to work
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  • [08:44:50] <twinsen1> hi all!
  • [08:46:17] <twinsen1> I want to update the flash (uboot and kernel) from Angstrom (not uboot), could you point some docs how to do that? Simply dd if=Ximg of=/dev/mtdblockX didn't work...
  • [08:51:10] * rkirti|away (n=oespirit@117.254.8.200) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [08:52:46] <twinsen1> and second question: do I need some userspace app/support for OTG to work? In Angstrom it works fine both as host and device. In gentoo it works only as device.
  • [08:53:57] <adj> you must use mtdutils for flashing nand
  • [08:54:43] <twinsen1> cool. thanks :)
  • [08:54:44] <adj> e.g. flash_eraseall /dev/mtd1; nandwrite -p /dev/mtd1 u-boot.bin
  • [08:55:15] <adj> that will update your u-boot
  • [08:55:22] <twinsen1> that's it! I've seen it somewhere on the net, but I couldn't find it now
  • [08:55:49] <adj> for x-loader which needs that odd hw ecc, hmm.... that might need something different
  • [08:56:29] <twinsen1> I don't want to flash xloader, AFAIK that can only be done from uboot with hwecc
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  • [08:57:14] <adj> ok, that might very well be so
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  • [09:10:46] <koen> and aren't the partition write protected by the kernel?
  • [09:12:08] <adj> yes it is, good point
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  • [09:20:48] <_av500_> anf when will uboot and kernel agree on ecc?
  • [09:21:29] <mru> they do afaik, it's the rom loader that doesn't
  • [09:22:20] <_av500_> iirc, here they all agree
  • [09:24:26] <_av500_> ill ask the lowly guys...
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  • [10:55:50] <twinsen2> seems you were right, /dev/mtd1 is protected, could update the kernel from linux
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  • [11:00:03] <twinsen2> re these instruction correct for flashing uboot? http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardNAND
  • [11:01:58] <twinsen2> correction: i could update the kernel (mtd3), but not uboot (mtd1) from linux
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  • [11:17:02] <jule> I am tryng to boot from an Angstrom distro... but i get the error: "Wrong Image Format for bootm command" i got this bootm: setenv bootcmd 'mmc init;fatload mmc 0 80300000 uImage;bootm 80300000'
  • [11:17:12] * lweight (n=andrew@91.103.132.162) has joined #beagle
  • [11:17:22] <lweight> Hello hello
  • [11:17:50] <jule> what does 0 8030000 mean? is 0 the sector 0 of the first partition in the mmc ?
  • [11:19:38] <jule> forget i think i know whats going on "IMPORTANT TO DO THIS BEFORE ANY OTHER FILES ARE COPIED: Copy the MLO file that you downloaded to the Beagle_Boot partition. The MLO file must be the first file copied to the partition after re-formatting. "
  • [11:28:48] <lweight> does anyone have any pointers how to go about making a r/o Angstrom image?
  • [11:29:13] <lweight> I need to build a system that is fine with having the power pulled on it
  • [11:31:53] <jule> setenv bootcmd 'mmc init;fatload mmc 0 80300000 uImage;bootm 80300000' is thos 80300000 a valid number for ANY uImage? how do I get the correct number for my uImage?
  • [11:34:43] <mru> that number is arbitrary
  • [11:35:04] <mru> as long as it doesn't collide with the linked address of the kernel image
  • [11:37:08] <jule> how can I know whats my number?
  • [11:37:15] <mru> you don't need to
  • [11:37:20] <mru> 80300000 is always safe
  • [11:37:35] <jule> 80300000 or 0x80300000?
  • [11:37:42] <mru> same
  • [11:37:48] <jule> ok
  • [11:37:50] <mru> all numbers are hex in u-boot
  • [11:38:13] <jule> so the range 0 8030000 is always safe?
  • [11:38:20] <mru> no
  • [11:38:28] <jule> then why do i get a "Wrong Image Format for bootm command"
  • [11:38:31] <jule> ???
  • [11:38:34] <mru> physical memory starts at 80000000
  • [11:39:22] <mru> the fatload command reads the file uImage from the card into memory starting at 80300000
  • [11:39:55] <jule> "by mmc 0 8030000" means start reading mmc at 0 and put it on 8030000 of RAM
  • [11:40:18] <mru> 0 refers to the first mmc card
  • [11:40:35] <jule> hmmm do its ok then
  • [11:40:36] <mru> if you have multiple slots they are numbered 0, 1, 2, etc
  • [11:40:36] <Christos_N> Trying to bitbake beagleboard-demo-image, but after some hours I got in shared-mime-info-native_0.51.bb, do_compile : libxml2.so: undefined reference to `gzopen64'
  • [11:40:48] <Christos_N> any hints?
  • [11:43:25] <Christos_N> btw, other targets eg x11-image, console-image, virtual/kernel do finish succesfully
  • [11:44:15] <Christos_N> is beagleboard-demo-image broken somehow?
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  • [11:48:01] * Christos_N thinks no one here is bitbaking the beagleboard-demo-image...
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  • [12:06:12] <Crofton> http://helmetcameracentral.com/2009/04/27/vholdr-contourhd-the-worlds-first-hd-wearable-camcorder
  • [12:06:19] <Crofton> anyone know what is inside this?
  • [12:06:34] <Crofton> My friend will let me open his, for 280 usd
  • [12:07:36] <mru> wtf does "HD at 30 fps SD" mean
  • [12:08:07] <Crofton> heh
  • [12:08:10] <Crofton> marketing types
  • [12:08:17] <Crofton> the device itself is pretty cool
  • [12:08:29] <Crofton> he uses it on his hang glider
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  • [12:10:34] <Crofton> http://wind-drifter.com/Hyner/HelmetCam.php
  • [12:10:52] <Crofton> I am wondering if it is a davinci
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  • [12:16:03] <mru> Crofton: seems to be an Ambarella chip
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  • [12:17:01] <lweight> hrm
  • [12:17:34] <lweight> anyone got any tips for making a Angstrom/BB setup safe with unclean shutdowns?
  • [12:22:30] <mrc_001> lweight: use a journaling filesystem
  • [12:23:16] <lweight> I do already, ext3, but still thought it might get upset over many power up/downs
  • [12:23:34] <lweight> do you think it would be fine?
  • [12:24:22] <lweight> I only need one binary to run and it needs no FS writes, so was thinking of a r/o rootfs
  • [12:24:48] <lweight> but not sure about how to get this working (e.g. with /tmp in ram)
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  • [13:00:26] <jule> is Angstrom the best distro for the beagle? I mean it has problems with grpahic acceleration and sound right?
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  • [13:12:18] <koen> jule: where did you hear that nonsense?
  • [13:12:42] * koen gets cranky with all the google impaired people on the mailinglist
  • [13:18:55] <jule> i dont know... the other day some one suggest me to install angstrom
  • [13:19:30] <jule> whats the nonsense? the graphic card acceleration problem?
  • [13:19:48] <jule> or just the best distro for beagle is angtrom?
  • [13:20:16] <jule> what distro do u advice me then? I wan to male lot of gcc programation with webcam, wifi etc..
  • [13:20:17] <_av500_> koen: a simple script that mails the 1st google hit on their post would help most of 'em...
  • [13:21:49] <jule> what distro is the best in terms of programming/development of ffmpeg, web cam, client-server wifi programation?
  • [13:21:59] <jule> in the beagle context of course
  • [13:25:44] <_av500_> slackware!
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  • [13:26:35] <jule> slackware is da best?
  • [13:27:02] * mru is now known as _troll_
  • [13:27:04] <_troll_> of course it is
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  • [13:27:25] * raster (n=raster@enlightenment/developer/raster) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  • [13:27:43] * _av500_ fetches popcorn
  • [13:27:56] * _troll_ is now known as mru
  • [13:28:00] <jule> does that distro fully uses all the hardware of the beagle? I mean: audio, graphic accelaration etc..
  • [13:28:01] <jule> ?
  • [13:28:04] <mru> _av500_: don't feed the trolls
  • [13:28:17] <_av500_> jule: it was a joke, use angstrom
  • [13:28:33] <_av500_> mru: only on weekends
  • [13:29:02] * Christos_N thinks Ubuntu iz da bezt http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardUbuntu
  • [13:29:19] <jule> but I found in some page that Agsntrom got problems with accelaration and sound right?
  • [13:30:05] <_av500_> jule: last time i checked it was 9.81...
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  • [13:31:21] <jule> ok.. does that distro have the kernel headers and the gcc core?
  • [13:31:32] <jule> for development?
  • [13:32:15] <jule> is there any package intaller like yum, etc?
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  • [13:46:13] * _av500_ wonders why google is always down these days
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  • [13:56:49] <_av500_> cant sleep?
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  • [14:32:18] <Crofton> Amberella?
  • [14:33:38] <Christos_N> another one, lets hope this will get an answer, I've bitbaked virtual/kernel and added the PREFERRED_VERSION_linux-omap = "2.6.29" in local.conf nevertheless it downloads in tmp/downloads and builds on the 2.6.23... any hints?
  • [14:34:11] <Crofton> got it
  • [14:37:14] <mru> Crofton: strings on the sample file...
  • [14:37:40] <Crofton> ah
  • [14:37:55] <Crofton> from Richards recording?
  • [14:38:09] <mru> from the maker's website
  • [14:38:14] <Crofton> ah
  • [14:38:39] <Crofton> so the recorded video contains strings id'ing the encoder?
  • [14:38:56] <mru> sometimes
  • [14:46:04] * Christos_N thinks ...there are so many bb oe questions, and here are so few answers...
  • [14:47:32] <Crofton> so many users, so few experts
  • [14:48:03] <Crofton> Christos_N, I'd starts by undoing any changes you made to oe
  • [14:48:16] <Crofton> git diff
  • [14:48:28] <Crofton> and look carefully at local.conf
  • [14:50:36] <Christos_N> Crofton, if in a system we do not have information dissemination and got concentration of knowledge in only few spots, then the system will eventually collapse
  • [14:51:28] <Christos_N> I didnt any change to local.conf any other than the PREFERRED thing
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  • [14:52:50] <Christos_N> what I did though, is after some successful target builds, I've erased the tmp folder
  • [14:52:54] <Crofton> remove that line
  • [14:53:02] <Crofton> and pastebin local.conf
  • [14:53:36] <Christos_N> then, many weird thinks happened like the shared-mime problem that I posted before
  • [14:55:26] <Christos_N> http://pastebin.com/d14b4a46f
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  • [14:56:51] <Crofton> do a git pull
  • [14:57:01] <Crofton> and a git status to make sure you have no local changes
  • [14:57:13] <Crofton> what linux distro are you running on the build machine
  • [14:58:19] <Crofton> and remove the preferred version line
  • [14:58:23] <Christos_N> actually the bitbake is still running for about an hour already, I thought since it is only a uImage it could do it quickly, I'm building on a Ubuntu 804 LTS
  • [14:58:46] <Crofton> it hs to build the tool chains :)\
  • [14:59:00] <Christos_N> before the bitbake I did a git pull just in case...
  • [14:59:12] <Crofton> do a git status also
  • [14:59:53] <koen> Crofton: if people don't read the actual output before bitching on IRC, you shouldn't help them
  • [14:59:59] <Christos_N> do you think that the erasure of tmp has somehow affected the oe environment?
  • [15:00:08] <koen> Crofton: case in point: linux-libc-headers is not a kernel
  • [15:00:35] <koen> Crofton: one might guess it are linux headers for glibc to build against, but that's guesswork
  • [15:00:57] <koen> sadly I do not know how to google, so I can't be sure
  • [15:01:12] <Christos_N> linux-2.6.23.tar.bz2 ring a bell?...
  • [15:01:15] <koen> jule: again, where did you get that nonsense about audio and graphics accel?
  • [15:01:54] <koen> Christos_N: try actually reading what bitbake is outputting to the screen before whining on irc
  • [15:02:02] <Crofton> Christos_N, no
  • [15:02:44] * djlewis (n=bubba@75.15.65.232) has joined #beagle
  • [15:03:45] <Christos_N> I'm saying that in the tmp/downloads oe has downloaded ONLY linux-2.6.23.tar.bz2, is that normal?
  • [15:04:17] <Crofton> I have no idea how you got into this situation
  • [15:04:34] <Crofton> the only thing that really matters is the bitbake output
  • [15:04:39] <Crofton> not what is in downloads
  • [15:05:13] <koen> Christos_N: you said "and builds on the 2.6.23", where does bitbake actually say that it's using .23 as kernel??
  • [15:05:17] <Crofton> I suspect koen just gave you the answer
  • [15:05:24] <Crofton> but I am too laxy to check
  • [15:05:51] <Crofton> the last stage of the tour is getting interesting
  • [15:05:53] <Crofton> finally
  • [15:06:02] <koen> Crofton: more doping?
  • [15:08:00] <Crofton> not yet
  • [15:08:03] <koen> Crofton: I should make a recipe that downloads a file called "linux-2.7.1-preview.tar.bz2.jpeg" and get some popcorn as people start making unfounded assumptions
  • [15:08:08] <Crofton> I suspect the labs ar backlogged
  • [15:08:46] <Crofton> Christos_N, I think the actual kernel is downloaded as a git repo
  • [15:08:48] <koen> I don't think there are professional sportspeople that don't do doping anymore
  • [15:08:51] <Crofton> and is lower level dir
  • [15:09:41] <koen> so the whole doping thing revolves around people to stingy to pay for masking agents and people that do buy them
  • [15:09:43] <Crofton> Christos_N, also look for the bb file for linux-libc-headers and read it
  • [15:10:07] <Crofton> actually, I read one article that suggests there are some good masking agents out there
  • [15:10:10] <Christos_N> thank you Crofton, I'll sit back and wait with a bucket of popcorn, until it finishes and see what the result will be
  • [15:10:16] <Crofton> yeah
  • [15:10:17] <koen> Crofton: I think you mean "read output before making a fuzz about something that isn't true"
  • [15:10:22] <Crofton> I think every is ok
  • [15:10:32] * Christos_N thinks that someone has to stop being defensive and start helping no matter how big his ego is...
  • [15:10:36] <Crofton> yeah, but I am being "diplomatic"
  • [15:11:09] * chelli (n=chelli@debian/developer/tschmidt) has joined #beagle
  • [15:11:41] <koen> Christos_N: how can I help when you refuse to actually read the output on your screen before bitching?
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  • [15:15:02] <djlewis> How to test SDHC cards? console images configure and run just fine but desktop images wont finish configure on first boot. These SDHC were setup for BB boot in a HP Pavilion DV8000 reader once using Ubuntu 9.04.
  • [15:15:37] * cody___ (n=cody@dslb-084-056-094-230.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #beagle
  • [15:15:50] <djlewis> Since have been cleared of partitions and re configured with their Trendnet SDHC reader and same problem.
  • [15:16:14] <djlewis> cards test good under XP chkdsk and linus fsck.
  • [15:16:28] <djlewis> ?
  • [15:17:06] <koen> I put them in the dishwasher to make sure the bits are clean
  • [15:17:13] <koen> </mom mode>
  • [15:17:14] <djlewis> should I have said gm all :) first..
  • [15:17:26] <XorA|gone> djlewis: Its most likely your cards are fine, the linux SD drivers however are not
  • [15:17:34] * myhrman (n=miranda@h-79-136-58-55.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) Quit ()
  • [15:17:54] <koen> ES2.x omap3 chips have an mmc bug iirc
  • [15:18:28] <koen> 2.6.32 should have fixes for that
  • [15:18:57] * Christos_N is not blaming anyone, he is just another poor guy lost in space like so many others that do not know anything and need to find answers to their foolish questions...
  • [15:20:00] <djlewis> I have been using the trendnet sdhc reader and matching cards with success up to when I put two in the HP reader. seems it marks the cards somehow?
  • [15:20:25] <djlewis> And it will make a successful console card.
  • [15:20:49] <djlewis> 100MB fat 32, rest ext3
  • [15:21:41] <djlewis> XorA|gone: interesting. there ahve been some recent updates on this linux computer.
  • [15:22:15] <djlewis> since the card process worked...
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  • [15:35:35] <jule> Whats the best beagle distro for programming/gcc/development pourpouses?
  • [15:36:10] <Crofton> Angstrom
  • [15:36:23] <jule> k
  • [15:36:35] <jule> does it have any inegrated tool chain?
  • [15:36:42] <Crofton> what do you mean?
  • [15:37:00] <Crofton> you can install the compiler on the beagle
  • [15:37:09] <jule> well... nothing really its not needed if u program directly in the beagle
  • [15:37:19] <jule> but any IDE would be cool
  • [15:37:26] <Crofton> dunno about that
  • [15:37:30] <Crofton> I use vi:)
  • [15:37:36] <jule> eclipse or something
  • [15:38:02] <jule> yeah of course ctrl + k ctrl + z ctrl + h ctrl + y
  • [15:38:23] <jule> hey what about programming with JAVA is it possible? is there any JVM?
  • [15:38:55] <Crofton> yeah, but I do not know anything about java
  • [15:39:06] <jule> ok ty
  • [15:42:15] <mru> Crofton: programming in java is impossible on any hardware in my experience
  • [15:42:36] <Crofton> ah the local "java expert" :)
  • [15:42:53] <jule> but Virtual machine needs to be developed for specific architectures like ARM right?
  • [15:42:57] <jule> i think there is none
  • [15:43:18] <adj> java, the universal platform independent language
  • [15:43:20] <jule> or alpha ones at least
  • [15:43:48] <jule> yeah but you always need a bridge between low level calls and the higer java abstraction
  • [15:44:12] <jule> thats what they call JVM java.exe right?
  • [15:48:46] * raster won't touch java with a 100ft barge pole
  • [15:49:21] * lweight (n=andrew@91.103.132.162) Quit ("leaving")
  • [15:49:40] <raster> java is for those that believe all performance problems are solved with "but you can just upgrade and add more ram and a faster cpu to make it work!"
  • [15:49:44] <raster> :-P
  • [15:49:55] * ArteK (n=Artur@81.15.241.96) has left #beagle
  • [15:50:25] <raster> if you are using java because "c/c++ is too hard"... then i suggest you get better so it isnt so hard anymore :)
  • [15:50:47] <XorA|gone> raster: or you could just compile the java
  • [15:51:05] <raster> if you do it because you just like it and its so good... just remember, for every cpu cycle or byte you waste, god kills a kitten. :)
  • [15:51:39] <raster> XorA|gone: you could, but you're still going to waste a mountain of ram as a gc simply wont match regular alloc/free for memory use
  • [15:51:40] <raster> :)
  • [15:52:21] <raster> and even compiled - it wont match c++/c speed as you'll be adding more ovreahead in general
  • [15:52:30] <raster> (eg references vs pointers adds an extra deref)
  • [15:52:43] <raster> (and u have no pointers in java)
  • [15:53:08] <adj> c++ mentioned. Let's see who now gets an allergic reaction :)
  • [15:53:20] <raster> hehe
  • [15:53:24] * mru sneezes
  • [15:53:26] <raster> me. i dont touch it either
  • [15:53:53] <raster> but.. if you insist on operator overloading, polymorphgism, language-built-in classes, objectx etc. it will do the job
  • [15:54:01] <raster> i'm quite happy doing my oo in c :)
  • [15:54:02] <mru> c++ is one of those rare languages where disassembled binaries are actually *easier* to understand than the original source code
  • [15:55:24] <raster> hehehehe
  • [15:55:29] <raster> i agree
  • [15:55:43] <raster> reading c++ is like reading the future in tea leaves
  • [15:56:16] <raster> c is much nicer. following the calls and flow is straightforward - even if you make it funky
  • [15:56:17] * _av500_ fetches more popcorn
  • [15:56:38] <raster> hahaha
  • [15:56:39] <raster> :)
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  • [16:00:49] * Christos_N is having a tyropita right from the oven
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  • [16:04:09] <jule> How many GPIO's (electrical PIN inputs or outputs controlled via soft) has the BB?
  • [16:05:05] <ldesnogu_> IBM decided the back issues of their R&D journal are to be paid now :-( too bad their was a nice article back in 2001 showing a Java program beating Fortran at numerical computation
  • [16:06:21] * mrc_001_ (n=mrc_001@88-117-118-49.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #beagle
  • [16:06:25] <Crofton> jule, read about the expansion connector
  • [16:07:07] <jule> omg is not there by default? do u have to purchase it?
  • [16:07:45] <Crofton> what?
  • [16:07:58] <jule> i mean...
  • [16:08:04] <adj> jule: expansion connector has 20 pins which can be configured as GPIO, lcd headers have total of 28 possible gpios
  • [16:08:07] <jule> I dont have the socket
  • [16:08:38] <jule> well i think the socket can be purchased at anytime and the u have to solder it
  • [16:08:50] <Crofton> yeah
  • [16:08:51] <adj> of course if all of them are configured as GPIOs you will lose LCD functionality
  • [16:08:54] <Crofton> are you sodler wires in
  • [16:08:56] <Crofton> or soemthing
  • [16:09:17] <jule> no
  • [16:09:41] <jule> there's nothing by default only the wholes for attaching th 10 pin socket
  • [16:09:50] <jule> the 20 pin
  • [16:10:46] <jule> hmmm cant the JTAG pins be used as GPIO? I already have the pins lol
  • [16:10:51] * BThompsonD (n=bernie@cpe-66-25-52-232.tx.res.rr.com) Quit ("Leaving.")
  • [16:11:06] <adj> no, they can't
  • [16:12:02] * RobertBerger (n=RobertBe@ppp079166230127.dsl.hol.gr) has joined #beagle
  • [16:12:16] <adj> iirc they are one of the few omap i/o pins which do not have several muxable functions
  • [16:13:04] * mrc_001 (n=mrc_001@88-117-120-243.adsl.highway.telekom.at) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  • [16:13:41] * XorA|gone imagines the pain of turning off jtag from jtag :-)
  • [16:16:15] <jule> hmmm can the BB work with only 4,5V? or u have to supply exactly 5?
  • [16:16:47] <Crofton> see reference manual :)
  • [16:16:49] <jule> many cell batterys are 1,5V so 1,5x3=4,5
  • [16:16:52] <jule> k
  • [16:17:43] <XorA|gone> user 4x nicad to give 4.8
  • [16:17:52] <XorA|gone> or nimh
  • [16:18:50] <adj> well, usb host port is powered directly from 5 volt input (iirc). Minimum voltage for USB VBUS is 4.75 volts so for that part 4.5 volts won't meet specs
  • [16:19:14] <jule> hmm k
  • [16:19:18] <adj> but for LDO regulator which powers the beagle itself 4.5 volts should be enough
  • [16:22:04] * BThompson (n=Bernie_T@cpe-66-25-52-232.tx.res.rr.com) has joined #beagle
  • [16:22:18] <jule> hmm what about some 5V cell phone battery.... any URL?
  • [16:22:31] * pswiatki (i=594a6283@gateway/web/freenode/x-873c7a8a2e13e64a) has joined #beagle
  • [16:24:19] <pswiatki> hello, where can I find the change log for BB hardware revisions?
  • [16:24:36] <koen> pswiatki: www.beagleboard.org
  • [16:25:02] * KosiNuss (n=tom@R1ae4.r.pppool.de) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [16:25:27] <koen> more specifically http://beagleboard.org/hardware
  • [16:27:45] <pswiatki> well.... what I see is the specs. I might be blind, but no revision log there...
  • [16:28:41] <dirk2> pswiatki: Have you looked into the Board Hardware Reference Manual?
  • [16:29:26] <Christos_N> pswiatki, http://elinux.org/BeagleBoard#Availability
  • [16:31:28] <pswiatki> I shall check the PDF - thanks!
  • [16:31:35] <dirk2> Christos_N: Yes, for rough overview this is fine. But reference manual has all details in section 2.0
  • [16:32:22] <pswiatki> thanks guys, just thought such info would be on the webpage. But OK, I will download and check the latest Ref Man
  • [16:34:50] <_av500_> Christos_N: send some over...
  • [16:35:37] * Christos_N has eaten all of the tyropita by himself and got sooo fat...
  • [16:37:33] <koen> hmmm
  • [16:37:42] <koen> I ran out of filo leaves last week
  • [16:37:56] <koen> but I do have butter, feta and milk
  • [16:38:01] <koen> drat, no eggs as well
  • [16:39:35] <_av500_> i feel ou pain
  • [16:39:40] <_av500_> your
  • [16:40:06] <koen> I can trade a dm6446 board for some eggs ;)
  • [16:40:39] <_av500_> old board, old eggs
  • [16:40:54] <koen> maybe I'll keep the osd2 :)
  • [16:41:03] * pswiatki (i=594a6283@gateway/web/freenode/x-873c7a8a2e13e64a) Quit ("Page closed")
  • [16:41:07] <_av500_> what for :)
  • [16:42:36] <Christos_N> you can also do yourself the filo leaves with rolling pin, flour, olive oil, you know... but for the eggs you do need chicken though :-)
  • [16:43:35] * Christos_N is good at Farm Frenzy :-)
  • [16:43:49] <_av500_> Christos_N: but for the chicken you need eggs! :)
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  • [17:33:14] <lemay> I??? getting errors when I bitbake ):
  • [17:37:40] * docelic (n=docelic@78.134.203.90) Quit ("http://www.spinlocksolutions.com/")
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  • [17:51:22] <RobertBerger> lemay: I get this error: ERROR: fork failed:12 (Cannot allocate memory)
  • [17:52:53] <djlewis> have U seen the likes of this http://pastebin.com/m3a489b34 , on first boot during configuration stages?
  • [17:54:03] <koen> djlewis: which revision beagleboard?
  • [17:54:19] <djlewis> revC
  • [17:54:31] <koen> ah
  • [17:54:38] <djlewis> aah :)
  • [17:54:40] <koen> in that case it looks like your sd card is broken
  • [17:54:45] <djlewis> oh.
  • [17:54:58] <koen> if it were <B7 then you hit a silicon bug
  • [17:55:16] <djlewis> is there a tool to freshen a sd card?
  • [17:55:50] <koen> you could dd /dev/(u)random onto it
  • [17:56:34] <djlewis> only thing is common is after I partitioned this card on the HP DV8000.
  • [17:56:49] <djlewis> its been confused since except for a smaller console image.
  • [17:57:04] <djlewis> ok, i'll try that..
  • [18:00:54] * ArteK (n=Artur@81.15.241.96) has left #beagle
  • [18:00:55] <RobertBerger> lemay: I just finished a bitbake like this: NOTE: Tasks Summary: Attempted 366 tasks of which 355 didn't need to be rerun and 1 failed
  • [18:01:36] <djlewis> koen: except I am under educated regarding dd. this is a 4GB card. how to freshen whole card?
  • [18:01:42] <lemay> RobertBerger: I love to help, but I??? a giant rookie - I??? kind of wading my way through my own set of errors
  • [18:02:55] <koen> djlewis: dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sdX
  • [18:03:03] * jule (n=vanimad@89.130.94.238) Quit ()
  • [18:03:12] <djlewis> koen: tnx
  • [18:03:12] <koen> djlewis: where X is the letter corresponding with the sd card
  • [18:03:34] <koen> I do wonder how the wearleveling algos in that card will handle that :)
  • [18:07:15] <djlewis> koen: does it finish on its own?
  • [18:07:32] <koen> yes
  • [18:07:43] <djlewis> the card reader has blinked only a little so far.
  • [18:07:49] <koen> but it will take a while
  • [18:07:51] <djlewis> 2 - 3 secs
  • [18:08:09] <koen> does it blink if you wiggle the mouse?
  • [18:08:26] <djlewis> it is blinking steady now. without any intervention
  • [18:08:37] <djlewis> stops starts.
  • [18:09:07] <koen> if you have a fast card it can to about fifteen megabyte per second
  • [18:09:17] <koen> now divide 4096 by 15 :)
  • [18:09:49] <djlewis> its a class6 on matching reader.
  • [18:12:10] <djlewis> I was wondering earlier if the windoze HP card tool would do any good.
  • [18:12:51] <lemay> If bitbake is telling me: NOTE: preferred version git of u-boot not available (for item u-boot)
  • [18:13:17] <lemay> and it fails later - are the two correlated? Should I care about that?
  • [18:13:50] <lemay> as I bitbake base-image
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  • [18:16:05] <lemay> the resounding silence tells me that I have not given enough info, lol
  • [18:16:26] * djlewis patiently awaits the dd results rather nervously:-/
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  • [18:24:23] <RobertBerger> lemay: I would assume the u-boot git repo which your config wants can not be found, but I'm a rooky myself with beagle and Angstrom.
  • [18:24:42] * Grackle (n=alex@d-66-63-84-182.suscom-maine.net) has joined #beagle
  • [18:26:36] <Grackle> I don't have the tools required to open the beagleboard layout file.. Can anyone tell me the distance between the LCD signal headers? The distance between the inner two rows of pins would be most useful.
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  • [18:28:50] <Crofton|work> lemay, no
  • [18:28:59] <Crofton|work> pastebin the end of the messages
  • [18:29:07] <Crofton|work> so we an see the actual failure
  • [18:29:21] <Crofton|work> as we like to say, our crystal balls are broken
  • [18:30:08] * djlewis still patiently awaits the dd results more nervously:-/
  • [18:30:19] <lemay> roger that, crofton
  • [18:30:59] <koen> Crofton|work: did you get a refund?
  • [18:31:18] <Crofton|work> no
  • [18:31:24] <lemay> I will see if I can find them - it builds for a long time before it chokes up, and I closed that instance of the monitor
  • [18:31:34] <Crofton|work> customer service on crystal balls is poor
  • [18:31:53] <Crofton|work> ok, off to do some slum lording
  • [18:31:57] <koen> Crofton|work: I'll pickup the softrock when I get to the office in 2 weeks
  • [18:32:00] <lemay> they want to see a pastebin of the error your crystal ball gives you
  • [18:32:11] <Crofton|work> experiencing government interference
  • [18:32:19] <Crofton|work> cool
  • [18:32:27] <Crofton|work> I need to assemble mine still
  • [18:32:49] <Crofton|work> I need to get a rev C at some point too
  • [18:33:31] <Crofton|work> the local town inspected my slum and finds it lacking in certain areas
  • [18:33:37] <Crofton|work> some of which I am ok with
  • [18:34:05] <Crofton|work> but the end result is the slum will be in better shaope than several places they do not inspect
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  • [18:59:34] <koen> Crofton|work: you're going to put in an indoor jacuzi and outdoor grill?
  • [19:00:38] <dual> How does the beagle board perform as a webserver?
  • [19:01:04] <dual> Is it powerfull enough to run Apache, Mysql and PHP/Python?
  • [19:04:33] <Grackle> dual, it certainly is, although 256MB of RAM isn't a whole lot for running some web applications.
  • [19:04:48] <Qway> or 128 if you have rev B
  • [19:04:53] <Grackle> ah yes
  • [19:04:56] <dual> I've ordered RevC
  • [19:05:47] <dual> I had a 256mb VPS once. How would the performance be compared to that?
  • [19:06:04] <dual> 256MB ram*
  • [19:07:01] <koen> performance is probably going to suck since you're going to be doing all network IO over USB
  • [19:07:05] <Grackle> Well, I speak from my experience with running an svn/trac server on a Sony PS3. It was usable, though slow. I did nothing to tweak it to make it run fast, it was the default fedora setup.
  • [19:07:20] <Grackle> I just noticed that it was often quite low on memory, and sluggish.
  • [19:07:35] <Grackle> Er, the PS3 had 256MB of RAM, that's what makes it relevant
  • [19:07:43] <dual> Grackle: And is it possible to set up a web server environment on one SD card and for example a mini dekstop setup on another SD card, and switch between these?
  • [19:07:46] * djlewis still patiently awaits the dd results and am falling asleep waiting... :(
  • [19:07:57] <Grackle> dual, yeah, that's quite doable
  • [19:07:58] <koen> isn't trac python based and hence slooooooooooooooooooooooooow?
  • [19:08:10] <Grackle> If the cards are formatted properly, it'll work just fine, nothing special is required.
  • [19:08:20] <dual> Sounds good
  • [19:08:23] <Grackle> koen, haha, yeah, that may have had something to do with it
  • [19:08:50] <Qway> koen: yes.
  • [19:09:04] <dual> Would have been great to have a webserver environment on an sd card to test my web apps from time to time
  • [19:10:02] <Grackle> dual, what sort of web apps do you plan on running?
  • [19:10:39] <dual> Django apps. Not using it as a production server, though.
  • [19:10:50] <koen> ah, django
  • [19:10:58] <koen> see previous comment about python
  • [19:11:04] <dual> I saw that
  • [19:11:10] <dual> But Django is awesome :)
  • [19:11:13] <koen> it is
  • [19:11:39] <djlewis> yea! dd finally finished,
  • [19:11:43] <koen> but still done in an interpreted language that has never been know for its speed
  • [19:12:26] <dual> I chose Django because I knew a little Python from before.
  • [19:12:52] <koen> patchwork is django based and awesome
  • [19:13:21] <koen> speaking of patchwork, I still need to review the patches hrw|gone sent
  • [19:13:29] <Grackle> Well this is great. I got the bb allegro design files and the allegro viewer, but I can't figure out how to use it. :(
  • [19:13:59] <Qway> hi koen
  • [19:14:35] <koen> hey qball
  • [19:15:43] <Grackle> Oh hooray, I figured it out. The part I needed, anyway. The lcd headers are 125mm away from each other.
  • [19:16:05] <koen> 12.5 cm?
  • [19:16:05] <Grackle> (measured between centers of the inner pin rows)
  • [19:16:09] <Grackle> haha um
  • [19:16:12] <Grackle> 125 mil
  • [19:16:20] <Grackle> 3.175mm
  • [19:16:29] * koen stabs mil as unit
  • [19:16:35] * Grackle thought "mil" in his head and wrote mm
  • [19:16:39] <Grackle> Yeah, it's annoying.
  • [19:16:44] <koen> I made that mistake before
  • [19:16:55] <koen> which why I won't be doing pcb design anytime soon
  • [19:17:08] <Grackle> hah
  • [19:17:18] <Grackle> PCB design is a pain, but I'm glad I'm learning.
  • [19:18:06] * Grackle is designing a level translator to hook up a PSP display
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  • [19:18:16] <Qway> PCB design is bitch, esp when having to take RF in account.
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  • [19:19:33] <Grackle> Heh, I am aware that traces need to be short, and that at high frequencies trace length, proximity to other traces, etc is important.. But I don't have any real knowledge of what to do about it.
  • [19:19:53] <koen> it becomes a lot harder when the cheap pcb maker decided that you don't need a ground and vcc plane and leaves them out without telling you
  • [19:19:56] <Grackle> Or how to calculate/figure out such limits
  • [19:20:18] <Grackle> whoops, that must have sucked (I assume you are speaking from experience..)
  • [19:20:41] <koen> it happened to the guy next to me in the lab
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  • [19:21:08] <Grackle> ah
  • [19:21:20] <koen> so he got his phd on "how to simulate stuff when your pcb maker sucks"
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  • [19:22:00] <Grackle> haha
  • [19:22:21] <koen> phrased a bit more polite, but that what it came down to
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  • [19:25:26] <Qway> koen: I had some fun there too. esp if they around ???500 each
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  • [19:28:41] <koen> Qway: it was a fiber-to-the-home shared medium (a la coaxial ethernet) project in 2004
  • [19:29:01] <koen> so completely irrelevant, but the professor still had tons of funding
  • [19:29:34] <koen> imagine getting a fiber and then finding out the whole neighbourhood is in the same broadcast domain
  • [19:29:56] <koen> sharing the same 10mbit
  • [19:30:32] <Qway> well I get a bit nervous when you order a pcb for 500 euro, and can only wish it is ok
  • [19:30:44] <Qway> esp with a antenna printed on it
  • [19:35:19] <Qway> a well
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  • [19:58:48] <Christos_N> when I look at oe build screen, the messages are always NOTE:, sometimes though I see ERROR: and a message but bitbake keeps on going (JohhnyWalker style...) without stopping. Are these errors not significant?
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  • [20:00:18] <Christos_N> eg from the bitbake beagleboard-demo-image that runs for some time now, I've seen ERROR: QA Issue with tk: non -dev package contains symlink .so: tk path '/work/armv7a-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/tk-8.4.19-r0/install/tk/usr/lib/libtk8.4.so'
  • [20:00:44] <rkirti> Christos_N: unless you are doing a bitbake -k <foobar> (note the -k that allows it to continue inspite of errors), theres nothing to worry about.
  • [20:01:55] <Christos_N> ok & thanks
  • [20:02:01] <rkirti> Christos_N: Common errors/warnings are about its package QA, setting preferred providers etc, which you will come to know when you toy around a lil more with it
  • [20:02:33] <Christos_N> Quality Assurance?
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  • [21:12:22] <billenium> Could i use the expansion header to control motor(s)?
  • [21:21:44] <Grackle> Yes billenium, but you will probably need opto-isolators and transistors to protect the beagleboard from back emf and allow it to switch the relatively (or absolutely) large currents required to run the motor
  • [21:22:29] <Grackle> The signals on the expansion header come directly from the CPU, they are 1.8v and cannot source much current, so you will not be able to run a motor directly from them.
  • [21:23:35] <billenium> Hmm okay, well, a board could always be made. Can i power the entire board from the expansion headers?
  • [21:28:19] <Grackle> Yeah, you can get 5V off of pin 2.
  • [21:28:52] <Grackle> And 1.8V at very low current (enough to run logic level translators) off of pin 1
  • [21:29:02] * razh (n=hsi@2001:16d8:ff1a:0:216:3eff:fe64:feb3) Quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
  • [21:29:08] <billenium> Oh, i mean power the Beagleboard from the expansion headers.
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  • [21:29:30] <billenium> Not power the expansion board from the expansion header, though that was good information to know, thank you :)
  • [21:30:14] <Grackle> ohh, hmm, I don't know. I'm not sure if the power you get from that pin is the same as what comes in, or if it has been running through any conditioning circuitry.
  • [21:30:48] <billenium> Hmm, i wanted to power the beagleboard by a battery... But i cannot find any 5v batteries :P
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  • [21:32:17] <Grackle> Ah, it looks like that pin is indeed connected right to the power connector.
  • [21:32:29] <Grackle> Haha, yeah, you'll have to come up with some sort of regulator.
  • [21:32:40] <billenium> Hmm
  • [21:32:59] <billenium> This was a reason why i wanted to use the gumstix over beagleboard D:
  • [21:33:07] <Grackle> I'm not sure what voltage range the BB can handle.. From what I've read, you need something that's quite precise, but that my just be various people covering their asses.
  • [21:33:15] <billenium> (but those darn gumstix are so expensive!)
  • [21:33:24] <Grackle> Yeah, they are.
  • [21:34:01] * Grackle has a connex device with a pxa255
  • [21:34:09] <Grackle> I don't know if they even carry it anymore, it's an old device.
  • [21:34:19] <billenium> Yeah, i think connex is over
  • [21:34:40] <Grackle> hah :|
  • [21:35:31] <billenium> or, i mean, they are weaning it out.
  • [21:36:07] <billenium> I think i might just bite the bullet and buy a Gumstix Overo Fire
  • [21:36:53] <Grackle> Hmm.
  • [21:37:13] <killring> billenium: have you thought of using the beagle with a daughterboard for the motor control using a microcontroller (i.e. something like an arduino design)?
  • [21:37:30] <Grackle> The nice thing about gumstix is that they're designed to be an actual product. The beagleboard's purpose is simply to show off the omap3530.
  • [21:37:44] <billenium> hmm
  • [21:37:49] <billenium> killring, that's an idea
  • [21:37:57] <killring> that's what I'm looking at :-)
  • [21:38:01] * Qway wants a gumstix
  • [21:38:07] <Qway> or a bb rev C
  • [21:38:13] <billenium> killring: you are making a beaglebot?
  • [21:38:50] <killring> not a bot... but I'm looking at using a network of arduino-type devices all controlled by a beagleboard based platform
  • [21:39:00] <billenium> hm
  • [21:39:05] <billenium> If you find anything though, let me know :P
  • [21:39:08] <billenium> I'll be looking also.
  • [21:39:09] <killring> seems like a perfect marriage
  • [21:39:38] <killring> doubt you'll find anything prefab at a reasonable price
  • [21:39:51] <billenium> There must be something out there, that i can plug into the 5V DC jack and connect a 3V~ battery to it...
  • [21:39:52] <killring> since it's a *very* specialized requirement
  • [21:39:58] <billenium> eh :(
  • [21:40:07] <killring> a minty boost?
  • [21:40:36] <billenium> Except the battery would be like... a li-ion
  • [21:41:01] <Grackle> I think someone could really get the beagleboard into the market of boards like the gumstix if they made an lcd/expansion header daughtercard(s) that added things like level translated gpio, ethernet, wifi, battery charging and regulating electronics, etc..
  • [21:41:02] <killring> principle is the same. take your input voltage, up it and regulate it, and feed your device
  • [21:41:28] <billenium> hmhm
  • [21:42:27] <Qway> I have a thingy takes 2 AA and outputs 5V
  • [21:42:31] <Qway> works like a charm on bb
  • [21:42:39] <killring> i'm tellin' ya, you're in microcontroller land based on what you're saying you're looking for. lots of folks doing all sorts of interesting stuff re: interfacing to everything you can think of. the beagleboard is primarily a computer/computing platform i/o with the real world is not its strength
  • [21:44:28] <billenium> So you should say i shouldn't use the beagleboard?
  • [21:46:00] <killring> the beagleboard is great if you need a low power computing platform. but getting it to interface, power, and control external devices isn't it's strength. take something like an arduino and use it as a control processor that the beagleboard talks to
  • [21:46:43] <billenium> oh i see.
  • [21:47:21] <billenium> killring: where do you buy your arduino toys?
  • [21:48:04] * Wiedi (n=wiedi@newton-air.w.fruky.net) Quit ("^C")
  • [21:48:20] <killring> I bought mine from makershed (http://www.makershed.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=MSAPK2) since I didn't want to screw around with getting started but you can get basic kits in the $30-50 range
  • [21:48:27] <Grackle> You could, if you wanted, set up an arduino or somesuch to do all of the hardware control, then talk to it over serial with the beagleboard, and have the beagleboard do things like networking and computer vision and run all of the actual robot logic
  • [21:48:35] <killring> exactly
  • [21:48:53] <killring> bb is great for the computation part of the problem
  • [21:50:15] <killring> and bb can communicate via usb/i2c out of the box or you can add bluetooth/wifi/whatever you can dream up
  • [21:50:24] <killring> er, arduino can that is
  • [21:52:08] <Grackle> hah well that is true of the bb also
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  • [21:52:33] <killring> it's a lot less effort with a microcontroller since they were designed for that purpose
  • [21:53:19] <killring> odds are, to get the bb to deal with some of these devices most people would use a microcontroller as the interface
  • [21:53:41] <billenium> Sounds good
  • [21:54:50] <billenium> http://www.makershed.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=MKSP4
  • [21:54:53] <billenium> Is that in the ball park?
  • [21:57:19] <Grackle> Yeah, an arduino would compliment the beagleboard nicely. If you're thinking about getting an arduino, I'd suggest looking at seeed studios' offerings: http://www.seeedstudio.com/blog/?page_id=110
  • [21:57:40] * ldesnogu_ (n=ldesnogu@ven06-2-82-247-86-183.fbx.proxad.net) Quit ("Leaving")
  • [21:57:47] <Grackle> It's the same thing, but there are some tweaks that may make it more suitable, depending on your application.
  • [21:59:31] <killring> yep that's the same board from the kit
  • [22:00:15] <killring> the nice thing about the platform is that everything (h/w and s/w) is open source
  • [22:00:48] <killring> so you can prototype your solution on the 'standard' arduino then build your own version of one for the final solution
  • [22:01:52] <Grackle> The Arduino is an interesting phenomenon in the world of hobby electronics and embedded devices. It's cheap and forgiving, and very easy to get started with. I think a lot of people have gotten into device programming because it's so easy now.. And that's opened the market to a lot of cool devices.
  • [22:02:19] <Grackle> Hmm killring, I never considered doing that, though it certainly makes sense.
  • [22:03:09] <killring> they've effectively reduced hobby electronics to playing with lego
  • [22:03:40] <killring> you don't worry about getting up and running, you can jump right to what you want to do and have a pretty large pool of existing work to build on
  • [22:04:51] <billenium> sorry i was making dinner :P
  • [22:04:55] <billenium> good stuff, good stuff
  • [22:05:33] <Grackle> haha, re lego: http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/electronic-bricks-c-44.html?zenid=ac921a15df9939965b2dfb2029e457cf
  • [22:05:33] <killring> grackle: yep. I never considered what open source hardware would really mean until I started learning about the arduino. very cool stuff
  • [22:07:05] <billenium> I googled around for motors to USB... and i remember seeing something that looks EXACTLY like this: http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/electronic-brick-2pin-plugable-terminal-modulead-p-400.html?zenid=ac921a15df9939965b2dfb2029e457cf
  • [22:07:10] <billenium> Anyone know what it is?
  • [22:07:31] <XorA|gone> crap I need a newer libtool-cross
  • [22:08:30] <Grackle> I dunno billenium, but it sounds like it could be useful.
  • [22:08:38] <killring> billenium: it's just an attempt at making a standardized connector scheme for inputs and outputs to further simplify making things
  • [22:09:07] <billenium> heh okay
  • [22:09:08] <killring> they're basically making the decision for you: 'you will connect things this way'
  • [22:09:17] <billenium> oh
  • [22:09:21] <billenium> So they aren't the same thing?
  • [22:09:27] <billenium> similar*
  • [22:10:13] <killring> looks the same to me... I was just commenting on the concept of what they're doing
  • [22:10:23] <billenium> oh
  • [22:10:27] <Grackle> Oh, no, that's just an adapter of sorts. If you want to drive motors using USB, you'd need some sort of USB i/o device with appropriate drivers and motor driving hardware..
  • [22:11:12] <billenium> Hmm
  • [22:11:18] <billenium> well that is actually exactly what i want, Grackle.
  • [22:12:09] <killring> the only question is if someone has already built the 'brick' you want or not
  • [22:12:53] <billenium> Hmm
  • [22:12:57] <billenium> Only one way to find out
  • [22:13:03] <killring> the sensor board plugs into the arduino and the bricks plug into the sensor board but you still need to write the software to make it do what you want
  • [22:13:25] <killring> and for motors it will probably be a little more complicated due to the power requirements
  • [22:13:33] <billenium> Hmm
  • [22:13:40] <billenium> Maybe i was just not supposed to use motors...
  • [22:14:10] <killring> it's all very doable, but we're still very much at the diy or spend a lot of money stage with robotics
  • [22:14:22] <billenium> heh bummer
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  • [22:14:52] <billenium> killring!: http://www.pc-control.co.uk/motorbee_info.htm
  • [22:14:56] <billenium> Very nice :)
  • [22:15:12] <killring> 5 years ago, people would have killed just to have what the beagleboard and arduino provide today
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  • [22:15:45] <billenium> I could just get a motorbee :D
  • [22:15:52] <killring> if that does everything you need it to, you should get it
  • [22:17:25] <killring> I was only suggesting the arduino as a general purpose solution, if there's a more specialized one that solves your problem, by all means go for it
  • [22:17:37] * Qway is now known as Sarah
  • [22:17:42] <billenium> :P
  • [22:17:51] <billenium> Just googling "control motors from USB"
  • [22:18:07] * Sarah is now known as Guest69490
  • [22:18:40] * Guest69490 is now known as Fiorella
  • [22:18:48] <killring> the main thing you need to be sure of is that it does what you need. the second you exceed the capabilities of the solution, life starts getting more complicated
  • [22:20:52] <killring> just like if your computer can handle 'x' amount of ram and you want to put in x+y, you're sol
  • [22:23:29] <billenium> oh wow
  • [22:23:36] <billenium> http://www.pololu.com/catalog/product/410
  • [22:23:38] <billenium> Amazing things...
  • [22:23:46] <billenium> So tiny, yet it can do EXACTLY what i want :P
  • [22:23:50] <billenium> control two motors
  • [22:24:38] <billenium> crazy :)
  • [22:24:51] <killring> lots of cool toys out there
  • [22:26:16] <killring> as soon as they get these (http://world.honda.com/ASIMO/) down to $99, I'll buy one ;-)
  • [22:37:49] <billenium> heh
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